This was an awful game... Hopefully the game against the Knicks will be be better.
It's like McHale is deliberately screwing with his head and making him look bad. - Prevent Jeremy from getting 40 and winning the game when he's hot (Spurs). - Prevent Jeremy from getting 10+ assists and maybe a double-double against Rondo (Celtics). - Yank Jeremy on a cold game...and then surprise sub him late in the 4th (Today) after benching him all month. But no, let's blame Jeremy for "not performing"...even though he's been playing so much better of late and STILL not allowed to be a point guard. No wonder Lowry wanted out...McHale's a two-faced moron. Look, Jeremy is the STARTING POINT GUARD. He should be playing 35+ every night unless he's injured on in foul trouble. Especially since he isn't being used much when he's in. He could play 40 minutes a night since he's just being used like Derek Fisher.Jeremy is far too kind to criticize outright. But I hope he at least drops a few clues. Stuff like: "It's hard to find your rhythm, when you don't know when you're coming in or out" or "I've been playing pretty well of late, but I'm playing less than ever." or "That Spurs game was the first time I've been handling the ball. I wish I could've played in the 4th more, but that's up to Coach."
He said himself his knee is still swelling. That seems like a medically sound reason for limiting his minutes. Instead of a vast conspiracy engineered by a racist coach to undermine his players from right under Morey and Alexander's eyes, who mysteriously never notice their investments being sabotaged. But nah, I'm sure youre not only a certified doctor, but a Knee specialist who can diagnose minute details over a League Pass video stream. OK.
I also assume you're also a psychologist and can read Jeremy's thoughts better than he can himself. Jonathan Feigen @Jonathan_FeigenLin: "It's a matter of figuring out how to ... play more like myself w/in the system. I'll be my harshest critic, but I'm doing terrible."^ He certainly doesn't seem to think his play has been "so much better" or "pretty well" like you do. But I'm SURE you have a better handle on the man's own thoughts and game than he does himself. Hey, it's not like he's a smart guy or anything. What school did he go to again?
@Daniel, Mchale's pretty straight forward. He' doesn't beat around the bush or make a huge effort to protect his players from the media. He says it like it is. He's not limiting Lin's minutes because his knee is still swelling. He's limiting Lin's minutes because he's not producing the way the Rockets want/need him to.Maybe fans need to start accepting that, with Lin's role, he's going to be inconsistent this year.
True.Sorry for McHale but he must be sacked. I don't know why he fell in love with douglas. He got no faith in jeremy and he proved that day after day. Jeremy, though, must improve his defence when they try to screen him out. And, he don't have to try the steal on every possession. Sometimes he just has to defend and nothing else. If he learns that he'll be perfect in D.About the offense, I don't know why they're playin jeremy on the right so he must turn to left everytime. That's silly. Harden is the one who can score from right and left. They just have to wait the D collapse on jeremy and let harden fires from 3. They can try for just a single game at least...
@Daniel, quit being so condescending, you're acting like a real f.uck face.
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To the poster about a knee specialist. I am a doctor in Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation, a knee specialist in musculoskeletal medicine. If there is knee inflammation, then this means it is not totally healed. It should have been by now. For there to be fluid building up (this means that it is not articulating perfectly).However, when he plays over 40 minutes some days and sits out the 4th quarter other days has nothing to do with this. As a physician, if there is swelling, then I would like him to not play more than a certain amount of minutes consistently, every quarter and every game. When the swelling or pain decreases, you can increase the minutes. But there is no pattern so this is immaterial.
So him playing less minutes IS a good thing if his knee is still swelling as he claims it is? You say if that's the case you, as a Dr. would have him be limited every game minutes wise. But how do you know that's not what the Rox Dr.s have said? Because some games he plays more? That's b/c in the NBA Drs don't always get the final say. If the game is winnable and the player is playing well, sometimes teams disregard the DR's advice and play the guy longer than they "should". So no matter how you slice it, IF we take him at his word and his knee is still healing, some rest on some games is still good for the health and recovery of his knee, right? It might not be as good as limited minutes in Every game, but still better than playing him 35+ a night as many here are calling for right?
daniel is a clueless bum. when lin is permanently benched/traded, it wouldn't be the first time mcfail has run a point guard out of town. lowry even made the outrageous/bold claim that he and dragic would not stay the following season because of mcfail. personal tragedy aside, mcfail is a moron with shit substitutions a la danphoney, a ridiculous inability to draw up a single play, and a terrible coach in general. a great hall of famer who has absolutely no business being involved with anything basketball related anymore. see isiah thomas.get off his nuts you bum.
He probably is a moron who can't coach a lick. I never said he WASN'T. I remember how he was in Minnesota. But thats world's away from Blaming him for purposely and maliciously trying to ruin Jeremy's career. THAT takes an enormous amount of blindness and defensive thinking to accept. Ya'll are just too busy shielding our precious flower Jeremy from ANY criticism. Just accept that young PGs struggle often and get benched a lot (chauncey, parker, nash, etc the list of Great PGs who started out their career w/inconsistent minutes is LONG), that he has to learn to play with Harden in the same way Parker and Ginobilli learned, and that he ISN'T the VICTIM of some Large-Scale Conspiracy to Destroy His Career Out Of Racial Animus. ^ ...Is that too much to ask from LinNation?
If it is still healing, then yeah, this is good for Lin's knee. However, you can see that the coach just plays Lin with the flow of the game and often benches him for no reason - not for the knee (so yes, McHale just does what he feels like, probably not out of medical reason). If for example, you play him 1.5 quarters straight, this could mean more inflammation for the knee. It makes sense to give his knee rest at specific and consistent times.It's hard to say, however, what amount of time is good for a recovering knee. You would have to go with the patient's inflammation and pain as indicators. The tissue is probably not fully healed if there is swelling, which equals irritation of something, in this case the meniscus.I can tell though that McHale does not follow the doctor's advice specifically, though he probably uses it as a very very general guideline.That time that Parson's got hit on the elbow by the way was a transient ulnar neuropathy (aka funny bone in the community) - the one where he had to take a time out and his hand was shaking.
@Stu - thanks for the medical points. So I ask you again, is it still better for him to be sporadically rested on some games (regardless of whether McHale follows the Team DR's orders or not) and not on others, Versus playing him 35+ every single game "like Secretariat"-style? I'm not even trying to argue you over his knee anymore. Just a real question whether the benchings are having a positive or negative effect on the health of his knee (which he HAS said is swellING still - & I'm not gonna say our guy is a liar so we assume it is)....?
why shouldn't they blame this idiotic coaching staff for having harden iso 75% of all plays? that, or jack up 3s? or for routinely benching lin in 4th quarters despite playing well in other games? $8 mill to be treated like dogshit?call a spade a spade. fvck mcfail. and fvck you too for defending an obvious moron that single handedly ran lowry and dragic out of town.
@Stu, sorry if you've already discussed this but after all this time, why is his knee still swelling? I thought the surgery was minimal/mild. I know every heals at different rates but from what we know, he had his meniscus repaired, not replaced. Could there be something deeper going on with his knee?
For the knee, that 41 minute game where there are tons of consecutive minutes and crazy drives, especially that beautiful tip where Lin moved it away from Duncan and fell down awkwardly is not good. So prob 35 minutes each game is ok, no problem. Playing 9 minutes each quarter versus 12 minutes consecutively is not as good. Medically, he is doing ok. Lateral meniscal tears are very common in the NBA. There was an article a few years ago that said 80% of NBA players who returned from these type of injuries performed at the same level, pre-injury.I can tell that his knee is probably ok. The kid has got game as the Spurs game showed. But not totally back to normal as Lin points out. Medically, he will be fine but driving to the hole takes its toll. That play where Kidd hit him on the head last year and he fell down awkwardly likely causes the tear due to hyperflexion of the left knee.I would love for Lin to build his game, pick his spots and learn how to drive when he needs to. In the playoffs you go for broke. If he plays every time like the Spurs, you obviously risk injury.
@ntt - you really think you care more about Les Alexander's millions than he does himself? How touching. McHale's basketball coaching ability wasn't what I went after that guy for "calling out". I went after him for INVENTING OUT OF THIN AIR a wild CONSPIRACY theory in which "McFail" isn't merely a SH*TTY coach but a MORALLY EVIL one. An Evil coach who out to Actively destroy Jeremy's career (and thus Alexander's money) not out of incompetence but out of MALICE. That simply isn't true. And it's a huge leap to take. You really think if "MCFAIL" was purposefully sabotaging Jeremy's career (aka purposely taking stacks of Alexander's millions and lighting them on fire) that Alexander / Morey wouldn't notice? If Mchale is simply incompetent and not qualified, they'll sack him at the end of the year. You can go ahead and call for that I honestly DGAF. BUT LIN-NATION NEEDS TO STOP creating CONSPIRACY THEORIES w/ ZERO evidence to excuse Lin's play at all costs. Jesus.
That was probably a meniscectomy versus a meniscal repair. This means cutting out or resecting the meniscus so that piece of it is no longer there. A meniscus repair is like sewing the meniscus with it fully intact. There is a slight difference. It has to do with the location of the tear. It sounds like his meniscal tear was in the more central part of the meniscus, an avascular zone where the blood supply is poor so they had to cut (meniscectomy) versus repair. The reason I say this is because he was able to walk immediately. In a mensicus repair, the meniscus tear is usually on the periphery, where the blood supply is good and you are non-weight bearing for a short period of time.In any case, none of this matters too much. These things take time to heal and the amount of stress he has to place on it makes it a slower recovery. Chris Paul, Blake Griffin had the same things essentially. The fact that it is his left knee is a problem because thats his jumping knee. In some weird way, maybe all this benching is good now that you guys make me think about it. His knee has a better chance of healing, though coaches are destroying his confidence and messing with his head. I say he takes over the Lakers next year fully healthy.
@stu, I see. So it sounds like he could have had his meniscus removed (meniscectomy) and not repaired.I know we're all fans and don't know the real diagnosis but CP3 fans say that since his meniscus got removed, he hasn't been the same player. he's slower, doesn't take it to the hoop as often. But Griffin seems fine.
A small piece of his meniscus yes. Not the whole meniscus. Also, think of the meniscus as a pancake in between the femur and tibia. If you have too many meniscectomies then you have no more meniscus, i.e. Brandon Roy. When a small piece is resected, I feel that the knee joint does not articulate the same or as smoothly (think a clunky motion) causing inflammation (just my opinion on the physics of it).
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The knee thing comes back again. Some said we use it as excuse for Lin. while some use knee thing for excuse benching thing.
Man...it's so hard to be a Lin fan. We get screw with whatever things we said. We say this, they say we are blaming. We say that, they say we are complaining. So we should either keep mouth shut or say lovely things like yes, lin's sucks. Yes. Mchale is right benching Lin.
@lydia - yeah it sucks. we are immediately targeted as bandwagon fans who don't know anything about basketball. good thing this is a great forum. go to Yahoo or other boards, cat fights galore!
It just comes with a territory. If you declare yourself a fan of one single player, people are going to lump you into a category. Lin fans, Kobe fans, Lebron fans, Rubio fans, etc. It even happens with team fans. Just gotta keep strong during the rough times.
There are plenty of people on this site alone who do not immediately blame everyone else for what Lin does and it is not fair for everyone to be lumped in one category.
*shrug*We are defined by what we do, not what others say we do.Labels are...irrelevant to who we are. Or they should be. Sloppy-thinking people and their penchance for generalizations -> Not fit to judge others.
the rockets are without a plan-game. If 3s go in they win. If they don't they lose. The iso-harden is failing cause they're doubling him badly. Some decisions are questionable at least.Today jeremy didn't play well as the rest of the team. He's been blocked 2 times by davis but nothing special. In this situation he can never find the right mood. If rockets plays like that, the knicks match will be a disaster. They want revenge, and rockets has got no defence right now. Let's see what happens... Houston can't play like that all season or they'll miss the playoff... again.I don't know what to hope, if McHale is fired or Lin traded. We can only support right now...Let's hope jeremy will have a wonderful game in New York...
HOUSTON ROCKETS' DEFENSE WON THE GAME AGAINST BOSTON AND THEIR AWFUL OFFENSE AND DEFENSE LOST THE GAME TO TORONTO.HOUSTON'S OFFENSE USUALLY IS OK. THE POINTS PER GAME IS AT HIGH RANK IN THE LEAGUE REGARDLESS LIN'S LOWER SCORING THIS SEASON. THEN AGAIN,HOW CAN LIN SCORED THAT MUCH IF HIS HEALTH STILL BOTHERS HIM?? MCHALE HAS TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO UTILIZE HIS TALENTS BY NOT DESTROYING HIS CONFIDENCE AND RHYTHMS. I FOUND THOSE BIG GUYS WERE NOT DOING THEIR JOBS ON DEFENSE MOST OF THE TIME. DELFINO IS A DECENT 3 POINTERS, BUT BAD PASSERS. ONE PIECE OF ADVICE, DEFEND THOSE 3 POINTERS JUST BY RUNNING CLOSER AND BLOCKING THEIR VIEWS. EVEN LEBRON WILL MISS HIS SHOTS. GUARD THOSE 3 POINTERS IN TOMORROW'S GAME. AFTER ALL, ROCKETS ARE A LOT YOUNGER THAN THOSE OLDIES IN KNICKS.
Jlin had a rough start. Maybe he should have done the handshake thingy with Landry. Rockets looked confused at the start of the game. One reason may be because it was an afternoon game. Everyone seems to lack energy and coherence. Another reason may be because Patterson was out. The team needed to adjust to Morris being in the starting lineup. The passes that Jlin usually hits for Patterson are not there. There were no chemistry on the floor from the getgo. Things just kind of snowballed out of control. Also, guys weren't hitting there shots. The only good thing I suppose was JLin got to play more, and yes the 4th quarter too. Also, I'm very puzzled as to why JLin is not handling the ball more. Parsons, Delfino shouldn't be bringing it up court. Once the Rockets have possession, they should have given it to JLin immediately and let him control it and make the decisions. Where's all the talk about the coach wanting to utilize JLin's strengths. All bullshit is what I see so far.Whatever!
I don't know what is Jeremy Lin doing on the rockets anymore....
i only caught the 4th quarter. lin was benched for half of it, then it was iso harden, iso harden, iso harden, iso harden, a few missed 3s from others, lin gets the ball and drove to a missed shot, rinse repeat.trade lin.
Agreed, it's a good sign Jeremy at least got to stay on the court to play through it. Although Calderon was just on today... he was making good reads off of PnR plays on everyone. I would like to see McHale continue this trend by sticking by Jeremy before the half and end of games... so that Jeremy is put in a position to be more aggressive on offense as well without having to worry about being benched....I also think McHale's system should emphasize more on individual matchups to get his guys going. Why isn't McHale calling plays to go at Calderon so that he has to expend energy at both ends of the court? Instead, Calderon picked us apart on offense and didn't really have to play much defense... How about some pick and rolls or pick and pop with our bigs?Let's hope the coaches actually put in some decent plays by tomorrow.... would be such a shame to waste the spot light at MSG on bad coaching....
When the game winds down in the final minutes, you need to give your PG the ball and let him do his thing and control the tempo. Each possession is critical. I know the Rockets wants to play with pace, hence the reason everyone has the green light to dribble up court and attempt to attack the basket instead of giving it to JLin. But again when the game is close and winding down, you need to be cautious and attempt to set things up with precision, that's where JLin is at his best. Give JLin the ball at the top of the key and run the high pick and roll through him. Harden can do it too, but I prefer Jlin. McHale needs to know when to play with pace and when to scale back and allow JLin to run the high pick and roll. JLin can run the strong side high pick and roll. Harden can run his ISOs on the weak side. Alternate between the two down the stretch instead of letting Parsons, Delfino, and Morris run around like their head was chopped off. Everyone is at fault, JLin included especially at the start of game. There's no coherence and it's bad coaching if you ask me.
I think my expectations for this team was really high after watching the first two games of the season. During those two games, the ball was moving crisply to the open player, the ISOs fun to watch.... Since then, the offense got stagnant... and more recently, the backup PG (no offense to TD) who is not really known to be a playmaker handles the ball more than the starting PG during crunch time makes the offense even more unbearable to watch... the calls that Harden and Lin were consistently getting at the rim last season are not being called any more. Which brings us to now where everyone seems tentative when we mostly revert to ISO ball or live and die by the 3's.... the problem is that our ISO's and missed FG's are turning into fast breaks for the other team and we have regressed on our transition Defense. Our 3's come in bunches or not at all.So basically 1/4 of the season is already gone but we still have not seen the coaches make adjustments to mesh the team on offense... i.e. passing low bounce passes to asik so he can turn it over, going up soft at the paint, no PnR or PnP plays for Jeremy or TD on a consistent basis (although TD runs PnR with Asik last few games and the Spurs game.) Space the floor better so we have multiple options driving the lane, and so on.I know it's a long season but still... when are we going to see the coaches actually try something different other than telling us that it's the young players who are not executing the system? What system????
@slash29 Harden is still getting the calls. He gets to the line an absurd amountLin is not getting to the line because he wasn't getting the calls even when he was fouled, and now he seems to be actively evading contact when he drives to the basket, or even passing out of shots the moment it gets defended (see the second TO in the Toronto game), which means that his trips to the FT line will diminish even relative to his ball-handling duties. Part of it is his poor knee, I believe. People who say its an excuse have no idea what it is like to have to deal with a dodgy knee.
Here's my psychoanalysis. McHale thinks Lin is psychologically weak as he's unable to perform when he's out of his comfort zone. And, McHale will prove this on a daily basis until Lin can harden the F up. I think McHale rather like alpha dog type of players who isn't afraid to be a ball hog and mess up once in a while. On the other hand, Lin's unselfish play probably crawls under McHale's skin.
Nice psychoanalysis and all, but it's not gonna pry the traps off Lin or cause opponents to let Harden brick and turnover at will.
Not his best game definitely...well to quote NBA 2K13, on to the next one!
Jonathan Feigen @Jonathan_FeigenAs I read through my timeline, amazing how Lin blames only himself while so many of his fans want to blame anyone and everyone else.Expand
Classy. Way to lump a bunch of fans together to make people hate lin fans even more.
At the same time while saying many of Lin fans just blaming anyone or everyone, he should justify what are the statement lin fans make that sounds blaming anyone or everyone! Most of us here are questioning why the coach keep benching Lin when he shouldn't and does that sound like blaming? I am sure that's what most of Lin fans are doing.
It's BECAUSE JLin tends to blame only himself that the fans step up. If even his fans don't have his back...
Now I find how hard it is for Lin fans. Whatever we said it just not right! It's either we blaming or complaining.
Well, I'M blaming Jonathan Feigen. That media haters typifies the anti Asian American racism rampant through the media. As for Lin, it's not his job to try to cut past the triple teams if the coaches don't implement the necessary cuts to relieve defensive pressure on him.
@ LydiaHe's probably not just talking about fans here on JeremyLin.net, rather the fans all over social media and other basketball forums since they're probably tweeting about Lin's struggles.Just looking at sites like Clutchfans.net and RealGM, there's tons of threads about Lin and arguments between Lin fans vs others.
Some Lin fans are like overprotective parents who yell at everyone when their favoured child is not doing well. They write to principals, they write to teachers, they think it is everyone else's fault when their son gets a B+ instead of an A, when of course, it is rarely only a matter of circumstance. Every single child, every single student, every single NBA player has to deal with difficulties. The best ones overcome. But the parents of such children cannot accept this, and they alienate people who would otherwise like their children. They alienate the coaches as they alienate the teachers by complaining about them endlessly and writing to them; they alienate the teammates by wrecking them and blaming all of their favoured son's mistakes and errors on them; they alienate the GM by suggesting he is deliberately sabotaging their son in order to make someone else look better; they alienate the owner by saying he only wanted their son for marketing reasons. They are super vocal and they write and some of them don't even watch the games, but feel like they know exactly what is going on.There are however the silent majority, who are the reasonable fans. They see Lin as a player with great potential, who has some flaws. They see Lin as a great story. They have life experience and know what it is like to work with people. They know that sometimes it is on the people themselves to make the best of their circumstances. They might be annoyed and even angry that Lin is being under-used or mis-used, but they recognise that even in bad circumstances a person can do well or poorly relative to those circumstances. They support Lin by constructive criticism, and by supporting Lin positively. They watch Lin games from start to finish. They understand that Lin is in a difficult situation, but they know that Lin has gone through far worse, and know that Lin has the mental strength to pull through it as a better player. They know that Lin has the strength to overcome.The majority of Lin fans, I think, fall into the second category. But there is a minority - like people who go into Rox fan sites to poop on every member of the organisation - who have no class. They think they have to lower themselves to the standards of the people who have slandered Lin. But Lin, who is a Christian, would have despised such behaviour. One does not go into the muck and behave like a wretch in order to defeat evil. No, Lin would prefer to do as he does: Sheathe himself in the armour of honour and humility.Other than a few, possibly racist few, writers, the vast majority of basketball writers are positive on Lin. Feigen started off with many nice words for Lin. The Rox writers (whose names evade me right now) are constantly saying that Lin will come good. But even recently in their podcasts they have been making humourous comments about the kind of stuff they have been getting on their Twitter. It is perfectly possible to support Lin without harassing or defaming the coaches, the players, the management, the writers, the Rox fans... But the minority of Lin fans can't see that.The trouble is, the writers are beginning to think that the minority speaks for everyone, simply because they are louder than everyone else.
I've noticed MOST haters don't really understand basketball. when you question McHale with his evident coaching failure, they'll say "excuses, excuses.." don't they know that it's a relative thing? coach and players should come together and work for the benefit of both. if one fails, BOTH fails.
I tried to address that by saying that one can still be relatively good or poor in "bad circumstances" and Lin's quotes (see below) indicate that Lin himself feels that he has been poor even relative to the poor hand that has been dealt to him. Well, even "poor" hand is relative since the vast majority of professional basketball players never, ever get to average 32 mins as a starter in the NBA.The important thing is, it's rarely a one way street. It is NOT all Lin's fault. That is absurd. Lin can only do as much as he is given. Nobody can perform off the bench. But it's not ALL McHale's fault either. There is a balance here, and the minority of fans swing the blame too far towards McHale, while the reasonable majority I feel see it as a two-way street. You see many reasonable fans like that on this board - ABC Baller, Kenoshi, k.smith, Cara, nom, etc...
The thing is, the power to set up the conditions wherein JLin can thrive [and help his team win] lies with the coaching staff. Fans can't help but remember situations where such conditions were made available to him, with D'Antoni, Woodson, coaches who have allowed him to "play like himself".As for helicopter-fans :)Well I would've expected media pros, esp sports writers, to remain unmoved if emotions do run high on twitter at times. It's sports! I do think there is this thinking: If it's another sports figure's fans -> well, their fans might be seen as hooligan-ish, nyah whaddaya expect of sports fans pfft! They certainly will understand it's just fans being fans.But if it's JLin fans, suddenly there is this added racial component [the asians], suddenly it's reflecting badly on JLin [as if he has any power over fans' individual behavior.] -> "Them".Fans are being vigilant and assertive as a reaction to the history of discrimination JLin has had to go through in the past. They don't want it repeated. [The spectre of Keith Smart 2.0, etc, etc.] People get nervous when they see JLin repeatedly benched for no reason -> It's the reasonable reaction, in the light of the existing precedent [of unfair treatment.]
@wiffle I'm not talking about the fans here. in fact I like the debate here. other boards, forget it!
Lin: "It's a matter of figuring out how to ... play more like myself w/in the system. I'll be my harshest critic, but I'm doing terrible."This is comforting, I love it. "play more like myself w/in the system". He's not trying to conform/lose himself within the process of adapting to a new system. I know he's going to be okay.*Should have listened to Khuang's optimism, ha!
lol at "system". it's iso harden and jack up 3s with no other game plan or bust!
My biggest thing was Lin losing himself and therefore his confidence while adjusting to the Rockets' system. When a player tries too hard to conform or be something he's not, he usually fails. The system may not be optimal but a lot of NBA players don't play in optimal systems. He's going through a tough stretch trying to find that balance. I know he will. He's not going anywhere. The system isn't changing. In order for him to be the player I know he can be, he'll find a balance between playing like himself, working within the system, and succeeding in it.
the problem really is i dont see the system. But then i just watch the game to enjoy and not to analyze every play. I dont really care about ISO play, PNR, run and gun as long as my team is winning im okay with it. Rockets talk about rebuilding finding the right pieces and all that. But with the direction they're taking i don't know it just doesn't feel right. I wanted to root for this team not just because of jeremy but because this is a young team that has lots of potential. But Mchale isn't the right coach for them or maybe im just being impatient.
"lol at "system".- Yeah, I wonder if he really believes this? Some people are getting on fans' "conspiracy theories." Well, it's either McHale is doing it deliberately [malice] or not [stupid]. Either way, not good."Should have listened to Khuang's optimism, ha!"- It's even better. KH is no optimist, he's an anti-defeatist. :)
@romz totally agree.
I'm not an optimist or a pessimist. I'm a REALIST. This is probably the first game that the Rockets lost that they could've won. But nobody wins them all in the NBA. As far as Houston's coaching staff goes, I would suggest that they need to be less reactionary. With NBA defenses still converging on Lin because of Lin's ability to run the Rockets offense seamlessly and get the entire team involved, the weakside with Harden is left relatively unguarded. Opponents are happy to let Harden brick shots and turn over because it gets the Rockets out of their offensive flow that works best with Lin. What frustrates me is that McHale and Sampson are content to let opponents dictate what the Rockets are supposed to be doing. Instead of running structured plays that get players in the right spots, the Rockets are simply taking what they're given. That means more Harden and less Lin, only that less Lin means less everyone else (i.e. Asik who's falling apart without Lin's touches). McHale has preached passing the ball to open spots more than anything else. However, opponents have used that to clamp down on Lin because stopping Lin stops the other Rockets. Ironically, Houston's pass first mentality has resulted in MORE iso ball for Harden because opponents are allowing him to brick and turn over. I have been wrong before and will continue to be wrong, but my impression is that the Rockets coaches have nothing against Lin other than a lukewarm distaste for Lin's increasing inability to shred the double and triple teams because opponents are trapping Lin's passing lanes with increasing efficacy. Bear in mind that NO PLAYER, not even Chris Paul, could beat the traps laid put for Lin without max contract midrange scorers AND getting the ball at the top of the key with a wide open court to work with. What's the solution? A Jerry Sloan style flex offense that has the guards moving vertically and the big men moving laterally would provide some structure while relieving pressure on Lin despite having no max contract big men.
Had to watch the game over, a bit more objectively.I don't know KHuang, Jeremy wasn't being trapped at all today. There wasn't much passing game. Lin has been bringing up the ball a lot, but there's no playmaking, its pass to Harden or whoever on the weak side, and said person goes iso...Of course most of it was just Harden. Wasn't much set plays at all.
I don't think Lin was being trapped so much as the Rox were collapsing in the paint on every player starting a drive, because the Rox have no mid-range game, and force them to try to make a difficult pass to the 3-point line. And since Lin is a player who is most effective when he is driving, it was stymying him badly. It didn't help that Asik was in full on butterfingers mode. As I said earlier, I think Patterson would have helped.
@kenoshi KHuang doesn't use the word "trap" or "double team" the conventional way. Someone guarding Parsons, for example, but paying attention to Lin's passing lane to Parsons, counts as a double team or triple team in KHuang's definition. This is actually an interesting and expansive view of how team defence works, but it is quite unconventional. Reference: KHuang's posts below.
Guys did you see what McHale said about Lin after the game? I don't know if I'm reading too much between the lines but I finally get it. McHale is basically a Stephen A Smith in disguise. He thinks Linsanity was just a stretch that any player can do but that it was nothing special. Lin is just a regular player and there is nothing really special about him. He just plainly and simple doesn't believe in Lin. In that case, the owners need to do one of two things. Trade him to a team that believes in him, or change the coach. I mean seriously, they are just using Lin right now and its disgusting. How can you play for a coach that doesn't even believe in you. Incredible...
can you find the quote for us?
"If you go on anybody's career and look at it, they're going to have a period where, man, you put up ridiculous numbers. I think he had one of those periods last year where everybody was, well, jeez, that's what Jeremy Lin is. No one in our league is a 27 point, 11 assist guy; even lebron doesn't do that. He is figuring himself out as a young player, he really is just a young player, this is the first time he's come in and started from training camp on. Jeremy is fine, he is just going to continue to improve."Read between the lines and what exactly is McHale saying? To me, he is saying. Lin had a crazy stretch and that was it, nothing special about him. He is just an average young player figuring himself out. I have so many issues with that way of thinking about Lin that I don't want to get even started. How is it that McHale doesn't realize that he is just not using Lin to his potential. That his "system" is not compatible with the way Lin plays PG. How come he can't see that, and blames it on Lin being young?
I think it was a fair assessment, perhaps it's McHale that's reading between the lines too much and not allowing JLin to control the game more than McHale is comfortable with. It appears to me that McHale wants the entire game to be played with pace. I think he should just let JLin run the show the entire game with Harden as a secondary option and see how it goes.
Honestly, to me Mchale doesn't believe in Lin and has no more confidence in him than he has on Delfino, Douglas or you name it. I wish that for one game, tomorrow. He would give the reins to Lin. Let him play his game and see how that goes. Just one try, it won't kill him. And by the way the Spurs game went, it might be good even though they lost.
Finally he showed what he really thinks about jeremy. We all supposed that. So we must hope Mchale is sacked or Lin traded. If that doesn't happen nothing will change.
Uh... Yes, wouldn't it be wonderful if all the stars lined up perfectly, all ducks were in a row, everything was there to give Jeremy Lin the best shot?Back to the real world...JLin is getting PT. It's up to him..... he's in the game, he's getting the time.... I think the focus should be on Jeremy Lin and not the fact that everything isn't perfect for him to shine.
Mchale never high on linsanity. He's not that excited when rockets resign Lin. Probably he thinks it's a hype too.
I'm with bamboo, and hope he kills it tmrrw. People gotta stop making excuses/reasons why he's not playing better. He's just gotta ball with whoever and whatever like really good players can. I mean with how he's performed this season and the hype around his return to ny, for McHale to heap praise on him would sound crazy. Nothing outrageous what he said
Well, he literally is saying "not even LeBron".Guys its not McHale isn't "high" on Lin, he's communicating that his expectations are more realistic.JLin does need to mature, he's got talent, but don't flame me by saying this, he is NOT an elite player JUST YET...Because he is inconsistent.Its like Jason Kidd said before Felton came into the picture: Jeremy has only one gear, and he needs to learn he doesn't need to run on 5th gear all the time.What pisses me off about mchale is his "system" misuses PGs and depends on great perimeter shooters...Something Rockets just don't have. Square peg in round holes and/or vice versa.
Imo...McHale's not the type who will give the keys to an unproven rook. Lin in McHale's eyes is a rook. If he had it his way, McHale would probably not start any rooks. Rooks need to learn to be professionals before they get to see any floor time. McHale seems to be old school like that.
McHale is probably a bit *too* old school in that sense. If Lillard was playing in the Rox he wouldn't have been a ROY candidate. He's absolutely right that no one averages 27/11 in the NBA though. Even 20/8 is elite.
The Emperor has no clothes.
Yeah, what "system" is the Rox using?
Jonathan Feigen @Jonathan_FeigenLin: "It's a matter of figuring out how to ... play more like myself w/in the system. I'll be my harshest critic, but I'm doing terrible."The Emperor himself is telling you that he's stark raving naked, yet you continue to insist the flowing imperial robe he's wearing is the most beautiful you've ever seen.You really are dedicated..
I think JLin's trying to tell you he's not getting to wear HIS OWN ROBE in this wasteland of a game plan, ach. :)
"The human brain is a complex organ with the wonderful power of enabling man to find reasons for continuing to believe whatever it is that he wants to believe."― Voltaire
I certainly agree.How else do you explain JLin's history of being overlooked? How do you explain people continuing to see him as a fluke? Apparently a special case where a player is forever frozen in an adjustment period, where he can only regress and never improve at age 24?- Captained his team to a 32-1 record and upset nationally ranked Mater Dei 51-47 for the California Interscholastic Federation Division 11 state title.- Named first-team All-State and Northern California Division 11 Player of the Year.- No Scholarship -> UCLA assist Kerry Keating stated in hindsight that Lin probably would have started at PG for UCLA.- The only NCAA Division I men's basketball player who ranked in the top ten in his conference for scoring (17.8), rebounding (5.5), assists (4.3), steals (2.4), blocked shots (0.6), field goal percentage (0.502), free throw percentage (0.744), and three-point shot percentage (0.400), and was a consensus selection for All-Ivy League First Team. [Junior year, 2008–09 season].- Finished his Harvard career setting a bunch of program records including wins 21, non-conference wins 11, home wins 11, and road/neutral wins 10, and was the first player in the history of the ivy league to record at least 1,450 points (1,483), 450 rebounds (487), 400 assists (406) and 200 steals (225). Again, unanimous selection for All-Ivy League First Team. - Candidate for the John R. Wooden Award. [1 of 30]- Finalist for the Bob Cousy Award. [1 of 11]- One of 12 most versatile players in college basketball as picked by Fran Fraschilla of ESPN. [Portsmouth Invitational.]- Gained national attention for his performance against the 12th-ranked Connecticut Huskies, against whom he scored a career-high tying 30 points and grabbed 9 rebounds on the road.- Outplayed first overall pick John Wall in SL.- During his stint in the DL, his defensive rating and net rating were the best in the entire NBA D-League. [His team gave up the fewest points per 100 possessions and outscored their opponents by the largest margin per 100 possessions while he's on the floor.]- Holds the record for the most points scored for an NBA player in their first 5 NBA starts. His total of 136 points puts him in first place ahead of Dan Issel who had 129 points. Ahead of Shaquille O’Neal, Freeman Williams (1977 and 1978 NCAA men’s basketball Division I scoring champion), Jerry Stackhouse, and Dominique Wilkins.- Wrongly-utilized by his current coach, in a system that does not play to his strengths bcos, as Voltaire will tell you -> The human brain is a complex organ with the wonderful power of enabling man to find reasons for continuing to believe whatever it is that he wants to believe.
@acon. ok. we get you! what do you want to hear from us? you want to hear us saying lin sucks like others right? Alright. Lin sucks. happy? we being fair now?
After reading this article, Oh man, I soooo wish that Jeremy leaves everything in the court tomorrow! http://www.nba.com/2012/news/12/16/knicks-jeremy-lin-returns-to-new-york.ap/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpts
Mr. potato head Woodson is really a wolf in a lamb costume. He always wanted to jab at JLin now he can. So it takes Felton, Kidd, and Pablo to fill the void, LOL. Yep, JLin equals all three of them:"I'm not taking anything away from what we had last year, those guys gave us all they had, but to win at a big level in this league you've got to have good point guard play. I think Jason Kidd and Raymond and Pablo have filled that void that we were somewhat missing last year," Knicks coach Mike Woodson said.
They are playing good now, so he can say all that with how he wants it. Just hope the game tomorrow is not that ugly. I think I m going to predict a loss with the way rockets play now. But hope it's not a 20 pts loss.
Jason Kidd is the true PG in the Knicks. Felton is slowly turning into a ballhog competing with Melo. Pablo, no comment...
I called it right when I first wrote last year that Woodson HATED Lin.
Didn't know he hated JLin but know it now.
I wonder what @eric will say about this?
Let me believe that this is what I saw today. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLk0dE8Z9U8 Need to filter my annoyances into something good. I'm planning on analyzing the differences.
In the systems.
Guys, check around 4:30. Would we ever hear McHale say something like this about Lin. :(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ua3J-FE1f0U
Awesome share, he said the keyword of trust the point guard. And guys you said it best below albino. He is technically in his rookie season and he has the talent. He will be awesome. This actually helps since it forces him to better his jumpshot even more. I do feel they should let him be in control Harden will be awesome as well because lin can get the rock to him just forget the iso plays.
I agree, Willox.
Guys Lin is essentially in his rookie season, I think it's perfectly reasonable for McHale not to treat Lin like a superstar yet, he hasn't earned it. Now judging from McHale's coaching (and very strange substitution patterns) he may be under qualified to be a head coach but I don't think he's out to "get" Lin if that's what many of you are thinking. Lin had an awful game for the most part but so did the rest of the team. At least McHale stuck with Lin in the 4th and let his starters build some chemistry in terms of finishing games.
Hope he stuck with him more often not just this game cause jlin needs that from his coach and yes of course he needs to do more work too.
I don't believe he on purpose is trying to get lin.... But I think he doesn't know how to release Lin's potential. McHale needs to trust his starting PG because Lin is capable of much more than what he is producing now.
JLin: "Terrible. I'm not doing close to what I'm capable of doing.""It's a matter of figuring out how to ... play more like myself w/in the system. I'll be my harshest critic, but I'm doing terrible."- No doubt in his capabilities. A winner who understands he needs to -> "play more like myself".
I agree, i said the same thing above.
Lol, yeah. Just saw it.I think this is what separates Lin fans and casual observers. We know his history of smashing through walls and "No"s -> heart of a champion. He'll def get through this.
and he needs his coach to help him figure out how to play himself w/in the system. if his coach is willing to help...want to help. there's no way he can play more like himself if the way the coach running the team is not suitable for him to play like himself. Maybe jlin should justify more what does he mean by "playing more like himself." does it mean to handling the ball more or just forget what the coach told him and play the way he thinks it should be?
JLin needs more pick and rolls. He also needs someone who knows how to pick and finish at the rim. Asik is a dumbo and has issues catching balls for some reason and setting picks. Patterson can only pick and pop. JLin's offense starts with the pick and roll. Other than that, I don't know how JLin is going to play more like himself in this system. So we're back at square one on whether JLin or Harden should handle it more. Lets bench McHale and Sampson and let J.B Bickerstaff run the head job for now. Maybe he has new ideas.
You don't want JB or anyone else on this staff running things. JB is Kelvin's boy. They are thick as thieves. These are all Minnesota guys. JB played at University of Minnesota.
@via Thanks for the quotes, you always deliver.I am happy Lin realises that he needs to play more instinctively, but I hope he doesn't beat on himself too much. Even though the Raptors game was terrible to start with, Lin did recover to play more fluidly, so he should know what he needs to do.
how come my posts keep gettng erased
hi, jay, if you are jay. if you are jay, you should know why. if you are not jay, maybe you should know why if you reply to jay. jay is the guy who make a very fun interesting term and some very interesting words. by the way my post got erased because of that lovely jay guy too. which i find totally fine.
Make that 8. I really cant see how the Roxs are gonna win tomorrow. I was hoping that Melo's ankle will keep him out, but it looks like the Pilsbury doughboy gonna play. The Roxs humiliated them back in November and they're gonna hit back with vengeance this time. The only way the Roxs can win is if they play solid on both ends of the floor. Containing Melo is gonna be tough, the dude is on fire. Defending the Chandler/Felton pick and roll is gonna be tough. The Roxs really need to rotate better on defense to protect the perimeter from Novak, Kidd, Wallace and whoever from raining down 3s. As much as I hate the Knicks, they're really good this year.
Oops, reposting~Howard Chen @ho_chenCSNThis was the seventh straight road defeat for the #Rockets after they won their first two to start the year (vs. Det, Atl). #RedNation12:45 PM - 16 Dec 12
I'm in a conference right now but I sneaked in some time to watch highlights and asked my brother to record the game for me. yes, Lin played a terrible first half, good thing he was warming up during 3Q but due to the whole team playing garbage they lost. I'm confused now, is McHale trying to run an offense that diminishes the PG as ball handler per se? what, is he trying to be a Phil Jackson who isn't relying on one ball handler? he is trying to lessen the PG-as-ball handler offense but rely on too much ISOs?
No, McHale is trying to NOT run an iso offense. He's trying to move the ball around, but he hasn't acknowledged that Lin is being trapped while Harden is left unguarded to lose games by playing hero ball. The Rockets coaches don't seem to realize that Harden is being DELIBERATELY allowed to play hero ball in Rockets losses. What the Rockets need is a mixed scheme between set offense and motion reading. Even with the limited personnel they have, the Rockets coaches need to implement some set plays to get not just Lin but all the other Rockets into spots where they can be effective.
Thank you Khuang for your analysis of the game asI didn't watch it.
McHale needs to let Lin play and fly for at least 35-45 minutes tomorrow against the NYK. He needs to trust Lin and let lin gets his vengeance against the knicks and prove his worthiness. Hopefully, all other rockets are there to support him too
I'm sure the Knicks will come out and actually defend Lin this time.Last time they didn't respect him as a player that could actually hurt them, and Lin KILLED EM. Stop Lin and you stop the Rockets.
Well he can keep Lin at 30mins I just ask McHale to run offense through Lin and let him be PG during that time.No need for him to run for 40+, let Harden/Parsons take the punishment.
Everyone has been asking and saying let Lin play more with the ball. I don't get why they just don't let Harden play off the ball, since he's done it playing alongside Westbrook most of his carer. Another problem might be is that none of the Rockets bigs have ran effective pick and rolls to punish the defense. Lin has gotten the ball to Asik so many times and so many times we see him drop the ball or get stripped. Patterson stays out of the paint to shoot jumpers.
My gut feeling is that they don't think Lin can get Harden in the right spots, so they decided to just let Harden get his shots on his own. Which really isn't optimal for either of them.
Red94: Rox vs Nyk Preview
The Rockets problems with offense are indicative of a generalized trend in the NBA in which isolation superstar set plays are giving way to "read and react" offenses like the flex or triangle. The Rockets appear to be an isolation team centered around James Harden, but they're actually not. They're a motion scheme in the mold of Bobby Knight in which players don't really have positions and move fluidly all over the court. The problem with the Rockets scheme is that opponents are BEATING the motion scheme by loading up on Lin and letting everybody else run wild. The Rockets coaches lack the sophistication to recognize that opponents are FUNNELING the ball into James Harden (Parsons to a lesser extent) because Harden and Parsons don't create for others. To defeat such defensive schemes that trap the best playmakers and allow the lesser ones to run wild, coaches developed static offenses like the "wheel" and the "triangle" and the "DAntoni scheme" that move players into designated spots from which they could make plays. In the NBA, the most well known static offense is the "triangle" or "triple post offense" which actually only works if you have 3 post up players at each point in the triangle!Lin has suffered on this Rockets team because the double and tripleteaming on him have resulted in his teammates moving randomly without the ball. This results in those players paralyzing the offense by stepping into Lin's driving lanes or being unable to produce with the ball. While I actually think McHale has been very good for Lin's INDIVIDUAL skill development, I do think that the Rockets need to employ more of those "static offense" schemes to get guys moving off the ball to spots where they can actually produce when Lin is trapped with the ball. I would love to see the Rockets pick up a static offense coach like Jerry Sloan, but Sloan likely wouldn't sign on because he doesn't have the max contract big man needed to run his cutting offense effectively. As much as I like McHale, I will readily concede that his whining that he doesn't have a veteran team is not the answer. Even if he had a veteran team, the only way he could win is if he had a team of 5 All Stars who could attack the traps on and off the ball. It's been interesting for me to watch NBA teams employ different coaching strategies to beat traps. The Knicks shoot over the trap from 3,, the Spurs get the ball to Parker where he makes plays off Duncan in the pivot, and Lin's Rockets try to have Lin hockey assist a big man who then makes a 2nd pass that's now getting picked off more!
@KHuang you could do well as a Rockets coach than McHale. while I've seen ball movement in the Rockets offense, it almost always end up on looking and being iso play. I doubt Sloan would take Rockets HC post, even if he's offered. I doubt Brian Shaw (protege of PJ) will take Rockets HC post either.
The triangle offense is a scheme that takes some smarts and a good amount of practice to master. The Zen master himself Phil Jackson has it perfected for the Lakers and Bulls. I don't know what team in the NBA runs an effective triangle. As for the the Rockets offense, it's primarily a read and react, motion (likely 4-out 1-in, spreading shooters on the perimeter) , and the pick and roll. For a young team like the Rockets, it's going to take time to understand the different offensive schemes. The read and react is easiest for young teams to run and develop with. I don't see where JLin is getting tripled team. The problem is that this is still a young team and learning the offense at an NBA level. JLin has been successful at reading defenses and reacting and running the pick and roll offense. Lets just allow him to do his thing until everyone else can get on the same page. That's what McHale needs to recognize.
Didn't see that either today (double/triple teams on Lin), it was mostly Calderon guarding Lin, and he did a decent job at it.Yep looks like motion except there wasn't much ball movement, soon as Lin brings up court he passes it off and they either try to hocky assist or just go iso, Jeremy was wide open a lot.
in this Lakers forum I am a member of, during the summer league a lot of Lakers fans playing scout thought Jeremy is the kind of player Phil Jackson likes and will force him to fit in his triangle - sets up team mates when defense comes in, plays with speed and IQ, attacks the basket relentlessly, a slasher. I think some teams have incorporated parts of the triangle in their offense. I think Minnesota Timberwolves did run on triangle seasons ago, when Rambis was the head coach.
As for the "players don't really have positions and move fluidly all over the court," I do think they know their positions, but not when they're running and gunning. As you noted, it's the motion offense of either 4-out 1-in (Asik/Patterson at the perimeter) or 3-out 2-in (Asik/Patterson in the post). Also, I see the players not playing their positions because of the Rockets uptempo style of play, or the seven seconds or less D'Antoni type offense where everyone starts handling the ball and playing out of position because everyone is handling the ball, like Parsons, Delfino, Morris. They should run to their spots on the permiter and get ready to shoot. Let JLin and Harden bring the ball up.
@isabelijane if Rambis was trying to implement the triangle in Minnesota and he doesn't have the right players to run and understand it that's probably why he lasted just that one season with the Timberwolves because they were losing.
@isabelijane I definitely think JLin has an IQ to run any type of offensive scheme cause he's a smart dude; however, I cant say that about the rest of his teammates. Everyone in the NBA can play, but not everyone has smarts to understand complex offensive schemes and apply them.Also, Phil Jackson was definitely interested in Jlin and wouldn't mind coaching the Knicks if requested.
@kenoshi JLin mainly gets doubled team in pick and roll situations. He seldomly gets a straight up double team unless for some reason they want to force the ball out of his hands.
Why was Toney Douglas a bum when he was playing in NY, probably because he doesn't understand how to manage and run the DÁntoni system but JLin does. Obvioulsy, Melo couldn't either being the "point-forward" cause all he knows is to use his God given talent to ISO and not his brains. The Lakers may be looking bad now, cause they're still learning the new offense, but wait until Nash gets back it will be completely different.
Also, via sometimes have clips of JLin showing his teammates where to go or what to do on the court. There you go, JLin is the cerebral one and knows how it works. Unfortunately, his teammates are probably still struggling with it and hence you have this disconnect on the court, both on offense and defense.
The Zen master likes JLin’s game, has had his eye on JLin since his rookie season in Golden State.
Finally, I do think the Rockets need some veterans. They have been in the league long enough to understand and recognize different offense and defense. I think that's exactly what the Rockets are lacking now.
@via. oh yeah, that far back.
What I'm calling a "double or triple" team has caused me to be flamed by Lin haters here plenty.To me, a double or triple team is when guys not just guard Lin but step into his passing and driving lanes. On the Rockets, Lin is the ONLY player who gets this kind of treatment because of his unique ability to facilitate and create. I call it a double or triple team when defenders ignore the man they're guarding to thwart Lin's every move. People have no idea how thoroughly TRAPPED Lin is. They watch Lin only, thinking that he's single covered when actually he's got guys swarming around him and anticipating his moves. Opponents are playing help defense and playing passing lanes ONLY on Lin while Harden is basically being DARED to shoot. Even though I talk about flex offenses and triangles and wheels and stacks and other highfalutin motion schemes, it doesn't change the fact that when Lin catches the ball he rarely has anywhere to go or anyone to pass to. With opponents cheating off his incompetent teammates and daring the one competent teammate to shoot as opposed to pass, there is no easy way out for Lin no matter how good his jump shot is or even who his coach is. When I think of Jeremy Lin on the Rockets, I think of those neat 4-1 or 3-2 schemes being blown to bits not by Lin's incompetence, but by the perimeter defender riding Lin's hip or back with the two big defenders angling themselves to protect the basket with yet another defender waiting to pick off the bailout pass. I'm sure Lin's Rockets coaches blame Lin for spoiling the neat little x's and o's drawn up on the board, but it's not Lin's fault that opponents can cheat on the stone handed Asik or the physically unimposing Patterson and Morris and Parsons and Delfino. It doesn't matter if Lin is handed the ball on every play and ordered to shoot no matter what. There just aren't good shots available with the perimeter jammed (except for rare open shots), driving lanes clogged (sometimes by Lin's own teammates, like in the San Antonio game at the end of regulation when Toney Douglas HELPED Danny Green trap Lin), or with bailout passes being picked off. The only solution is for Lin's teammates to keep on scoring when he gets ganged up on. That's why even when Lin doesn't score big, he assists guys who could not score on their own.
I think you are a very interesting person but I hate that you keep calling Lin's teammates incompetent. Also I don't mind your weird use of the word "double" and "triple" team as long as you explain it in every post. Fans who don't watch the game do see you as one of the true Lin gurus and they do use your words elsewhere, as I have seen, without realising that most people see the words "double teams" and "triple teams" differently. But as long as you explain your usage I have no problem with it.
wifflewaffle, Lin's teammates ARE "incompetent!!!"Lin can't throw the ball into any guy on the team other than Harden on a halfcourt set and expect that guy to create a shot for himself, let alone for others. Even horrible teams like Washington and Toronto have those kinds of players, but not Houston. I also consider Houston's defense, particular Asik's to be completely overrated. It looks way better when it's held together by Lin, but the slowfootedness and lack of awareness among the Rockets bigs is KILLING Lin when he's getting entangled on the perimeter by opposing bigs. Basically Lin is playing with guys that can't score on their own and can't even really defend on their own. A guy that can't score and can't defend is "INCOMPETENT", and Lin is playing on a whole team of those guys!
I disagree - a team that is in the top 5 offensively in the NBA, the best basketball league in the world, are not "incompetent" individually. I think they do not mesh and the lack of proper sets by McHale hurts them, but I don't think they all suck.
Top 10 rather
so McHale wants to play it as 5-man game but he's not making set plays and basically ignoring the 4 other possible shooters set on the floor..@via actually what I understood is PJ likes his game even BEFORE the rookie GSW days. Kupchak's also impressed with Lin, but knowing the LA organization, they're too slow to sign potential players. plus, Jeremy chose to play for GSW because of hometown loyalty. PJ's known to manipulate rookies and call them "lower than whale dung", but really motivates the rooks to keep on learning and work hard. @Racha I agree. I have said in other boards that a veteran plus one big man (my vote goes to Al Jefferson) can help the young Rockets big time.
Lin is actually SO GOOD that he can take that team of "incompetent" nonscorers and nondefenders and run them as a cohesive unit. No matter what comes out of opponents' mouths about how Lin can't play, they still know that stopping him with their entire team stops the entire Rockets. For a basketball purist like me, that's REAL respect for Lin to be guarded like that.
I am a Lin fan to say the first, he is the reason I came back to watch NBA again. I just do not understand why some of you keep talking about his struggle in Rox's offensive games, to me, it is really how bad they defend. Like Toronto's game yesterday, defensively, we are terrible. Not just Lin, when a guy was as hot as Calderon, I do not think it will make a big difference if you put other "ELITE" PGs to guard him. It was Toronto's playbook and Rox's team defense makes Cal looks great. If I am Coach, I will worry more on the Team defense (I think that's the reason why Coaches did not change much in their offensive games). Although, Lin and the rest Rox are not running their offensive as expected (Most people will agree it can be much better). However, according to the stat, they are already a good scoring team. Lots of people think the offensive system makes Lin looks bad, I think it is the defensive structure makes him looks even worse. Not to say he does not have flaws, I am just hoping they can build their chemistry, especially D, faster. At the end, we all want to see Rox and Lin succeed. At least I am.
Brent, you are right, their defense is porous, their perimeter defense is horrible, and they got outworked in the paint, Asik was pretty bad today.But that's not to say Lin hasn't been struggling. He made some pretty bad mistakes in 1Q...The jump pass (sigh I wish he'd stop doing that) and low bounce to Asik, I don't know why. He is also hesitating on his drives, esp after that block by Ed Davis, you can see it in his drives in 3Q esp that really easy layup he screwed up on.He's a PG and not being utilized like one. Its frustrating to watch, all he does nowadays is bring up the ball and pass it off, then scoot to the corner. There was all of 2 picks set for him, no one cuts/slashes/screens otherwise, they all just stand around at the perimeter, so he does his best to get it to the post. Once he passes it off ball to someone on the perimeter it almost never gets back to him.There isn't much ball movement as a result. Everytime he passes it off said person goes iso if they don't get trapped, or forces the shot.Funny thing is a lot of people came to see him play, everytime he scored there was huge cheers.Really, Lin played awful in 1Q, but the game wasn't lost by him. The whole team played like garbage today.
@BrentI'm with you. I tried to bring this up the other day, but I think most people here are focused elsewhere.For all the Asik fumbles, Harden misses off isos, TO's, or Lin underperforming to what we know what he is capable of, I find it amazing we have a top 10 offense, especially given what we were dealt with preseason. Think of what even a minimal improvement in any of those areas would do for our offense. None of those things are out of reach.Unfortunately, we have a bottom 10 defense. Even if we make the playoffs, we'd get swept or go 1-4 if this area doesn't get attention. re: "when a guy was as hot as Calderon, I do not think it will make a big difference if you put other "ELITE" PGs to guard him."You know, this is probably reflecting some attention bias on my part, but it really seems like in every loss, some guy goes off on us for a season/career best in something. Calderon/Parker/Bryant get triple doubles, Mayo goes ape, etc. So here's the thing: Lin's defense is demonstrably better than anyone else on the Rox backcourt. Nevertheless, his numbers have gotten worse as the season has gone on (but so has everyone else's). This hemorrhaging has got to stop. I know Linsanity was not about defense, but Lin can still lead this team and he can absolutely do it on the defensive end. While I'm not decided on the cause of his confidence issues, it had better not extend itself from the offensive to the defensive end. If so, forget the playoffs, 0.500 will even be a pipe dream.
@brent yen I agree with you that as a Rox watcher, the Rox defence was absolutely terrible. Offence isn't the main problem, that is true. I do watch the games for Lin though, so I tend to focus on what Lin is doing on the offence. You are right though, we tend to overfocus on offence and individual defence, when team defence is where it is at.@kenoshiYou said it perfectly.@nomI think the Rox can turn it around but it will require Lin to step up. Once he does, he will get the touches and minutes and playoffs will be much more likely.I don't have any numbers regarding defence right now but I understand that Rox are really bad at defending transition plays... and what creates transition plays? Missed 3s (long rebounds) and TOs - the bane of their offence! In a way I feel their offence feeds into their defensive woes. Lin is always hustling back on defence but there is only so much one can do.
I disagree with ALL OF YOU. Lin has been trapped so thoroughly that he is basically immobilized on offense. That has a domino effect of knocking out guys like Asik and Patterson who need Lin on the court siphoning defenses away from them. The huge offensive weakness caused by preventing Li from facilitating himself or his teammates mean that offensive players have more energy to devote to scoring. In the NBA, a guy who doesn't score usually gets scored on by a refreshed opponent who doesn't have to expend energy guarding him. Until the Rockets offense improves, harping on team defense will have the reverse effect of WORSENING defense. As we've seen in the last few games, the Rockets are not challenging opponents offensively and are paying for it defensively. All Lin can do is keep attacking and creating. His Rockets coaches better start trying to feature him more offensively if they're to stop the defendive bleeding.
I am not even sure how people trapping Lin on offence can cause their defence to be bad, so I have no idea how to respond to this lol. Considering that half the time the Rox are standing around watching Harden drive in, I simply can't see how the other Rox are expending huge amounts of energy on offence and how it is destroying the Rox defence...
To clarify to anyone reading this, I am using KHuang's definition of "trap" and not the conventional use.
12/12/12Examining the Rockets’ Defense
@via That is a great link. Your Google-Fu is amazing.
I didn't use good enough grammar above. The Rockets standing around watching Harden play iso are putting no pressure on opposing defenses, which means more stamina and attention for opposing offenses to go off against the Rockets. The traps against Lin prevent his man from having to even try to stop Lin's penetration. Lin's perimeter defender usually lets Lin go by and the sandwiches Lin between a big man in Lin's driving midrange. This takes away the effort of trying to stop Lin's penetration for the guard, and the guard then can save that energy for offense.
You have a very interesting way of looking at basketball. Without actually agreeing with your thesis, let me provisionally accept that having poor offensive players can lead to the opponent spending less energy on defence, which then allows more energy by the opponent on offence. In this case, the Rox do have two good offensive players in Lin and Harden. However, it seems to me that if we accept your proposition tat the opponents are expending their energy by focusing on Lin, it's not so much that that they are expending less energy on defence, but rather they are using that energy on Lin instead?
@wiffleI think KH is talking about "Lins perimeter defender" and "the guard". It is Lins man which expends less energy because Lins mans teammates are all playing anticipatory help defense.
@KHuangIf Rox is a team which gets only 90 pts a game on average, I will completely agree with you. I understand your logic, however, The performance of offense will always fluctuate more than defense. When you can not score (even on open looks), the only thing you can do is make sure your opponent score less. It is quite possible that you ran everything right offensively and still can not score (especially on young teams). Yes, you did wear your opponents down by running perfect plays (Not gonna happens every possessions anyway, just pretend it will), your wore opponents can quite possibly out score you if you do not D up. At the end, when talking O and D, both are just relative terms. If you can score 200 pts every night, I guess you really do not need to defense solidly. Leaving the D like the way it is right now for ROX and only try to perfect its O, to me, is really not a good direction to go. Better teams(players) are usually capable of winning even if they can not make the shots fall. They simply try make sure their opponents hit less.
The spurs game says it all, when Lin drives, spurs were simply amazingly kept collapsing (not overly) on him, and yet the communications were so clear that the perimeter shooters are still covered. However, Lin still drops 38 points even on this D, because you get hot sometimes period. On the other hand, when Parker drove to the lane, it was not even a lane anymore, it was a freeway.....directly to the rim. This just told us how bad a bad D can leads you even if you hit your shots at the almost-linsanity level.
Brent Yen, Parker drives unimpeded because Tim Duncan creates those driving lanes for him. Before you go about erroneously blaming Lin for Parker's drives, keep in mind that NOBODY in NBA history has been able to stop Tim Duncan from creating those open paths for his guards to drive to the basket. If Shaq and Kobe and Stockton and Malone couldn't stop Parker and Duncan, why do you expect Jeremy Lin to suddenly do what those Hall of Famers themselves could not do?And as far as defense, the Spurs have the GREATEST defensive big man of all time in Tim Duncan. Timmy's presence allows the Spurs to ride up on guys like Lin and conserve their energy for offense. Lin brings a lot of the same characteristics Duncan does, but even Lin is no Tim Duncan. Thus the Spurs look great on defense due to Duncan no matter who suits up for San Antonio. Lin is a magnificent future Hall of Fame 1st ballot player, but he's not going to be able to singlehandedly stop the Spurs from being the Spurs.
Jeremy Lin is wasting his career by playing for the Rockets. Time for him to sign with China and be the face of the CBA!!!
Lin has a $25 million contract, no way he gives that up to play in the CBA. He'd probably quit basketball before he ever had to go player over there! lolI hope the Rockets eventually just part ways with Lin. His marketing is only good if he's playing well. It's not about going to the CBA but rather finding a team that is better for his development. I think Dallas and Lakers are good destinations. Lakers can offer Steve Blake/Morris who both would be a better fit than Lin in his current role.Lin can be groomed back into a even better player learning under Steve Nash and have big men who can play the pick and roll and can finish.
Argh @ Rox mgmt...darren rovell @darrenrovellPOLL: What do you think of Jeremy Lin's future marketing potential? #Great #Decent #Poor7:31 PM - 16 Dec 12
Real basketball people know JLin's worth. Jlin is playing average ball now but there are many issues beyond his control. JLin has the smarts. JLin will improve his jumpshot. What else is left for him to be effective, not much. Oh, improve his left hand. That's about it.
Perception. Perception. Perception.His value is def not optimal at this point. Future marketing potential if things keep going this way..?
@RacSpeaking of jumpshots...
Interesting...on what McHale has to say, during Linsanity http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AAm5YTd794I think JL and KH need to have heart to heart talk, and fill the gap. Else its gonna be a loose loose situation.
At this point, the Rockets are probably ready for a lose lose situation and are looking more into the future. Lin was the main guy until they were able to get Harden. Now they are starting to see it might not work so early on. Their draft pick gets better if they miss the playoffs anyways and they will have a bunch of cap space to get another max player. If there's no progress with Lin, then they'll just trade him in the off-season.
JLin Highlights vs Raptors - 12/16/12
There's an old sports adage "A sportsman's results go up and down, but his class remains". JLin has such tremendous skills in passing (no-look, bounce and alley-oops which is why Magic Johnson praised him so much), decision-making, drive, speed, steals, defense, rebounding, etc. His current slump is his shooting.Lin fans hope he will join the Lakers who have the players to convert his set-up passes. When they convert, Lin will shoot better because the team will be leading by a good margin, stress level is lower and the team gets even better.Currently, the Rockets don't have enough classy players to make use of Lin's skills. Rockets need Lin more than he needs them, but I think he'll stay for a little while to honour his contract.
@rintintin yeah and possible he can lure Phil Jackson out of retirement to coach again.
If Dwight doesn't work out at Lakers, maybe Rockets could get their superstar by exchanging for Lin. What a coup for Morey!
@chachellechi - based on past Dwight comments, it'd be harder to get Phil Jackson to coach again than to get DH sign for Rockets.
These DUMBASS FAKEASS wannabe Laker trades for Lin are even more poorly thought out than the RIDICULOUS NY false reports of Lebron James signing with the Knicks or Dwight Howard going to New Jersey. Besides, there couldn't be a worse team for Lin to play on than on the Lakers next to Mr OVERRATED Ballhog himself, Kobe Bryant!!!
The worse team for Lin is the team we are witnessing right now. With coaches who would bench him for TONEY DOUGLAS. You can say what you want about Kobe Bryant, but he has 5 championships...how many do any of the Rockets player have?At least Lin will get a chance to play with players who can finish in the pick and roll. Kobe Bryant would be the least of my worries, as he would have to adapt to playing with Nash first.It's funny that someone would say OVERRATED when that's the label that Lin has been tagged with all season.
what non-sense, if JLin was on the lakers he wouldnt even be the back-up PG, he would be like the third option. No one on the lakers can run the PnR that's why they suck right now. And Kobe will just give JLin the death stare when JLin does try to run a PnR, and Kobe just want to run his iso plays.