interesting comment from jeremy lamb saying that jeremy lin is a "great shooter". guess all that training with doc is paying off!http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/02/sports/basketball/jeremy-lin-back-in-houston-already-feels-at-home.html
I love how Lamb said he can't wait to hear, "Jeremy Lin to Jeremy Lamb!" (or vice versa) on play-by-play calls. I actually think Kevin Martin will have a very good comeback year, but the future is clearly in The Jeremys."The Jeremys" - I seriously think that is going to become a well known moniker by 2014. And for the next 5+ years after that. As in two fans talking hoops and saying:"Who do you think has the best backcourt in the NBA?""Either OKC with Westbrook and Harden or Houston with The Jeremys""Yeah. Probably."
I thought Lamb's quote is *cute* and sweet! He is a young fella, so I think "cute" is okay. lol
“"Basically, it comes down to Houston made a commitment to him [Lin] we weren’t prepared to make,’’ -- GrunwaldThat is as polite, tactful, and non-controversial as Grunwald could put it. It took this long to come up with it, but it's succinct and masterful.And here is my translation:Houston made a commitment to start Lin. We expected to acquire Nash, in which case Lin was to be a backup. With our offseason public campaign, we didn't expect a single team to offer Lin a contract, which would have left Lin no other option but to sign our qualifying offer (one year contract for $1 million) to play a backup for us before we trade him. Well, we didn't get Nash to start alongside Carmelo, so then our best option was to sign Felton to play alongside Carmelo; at that point, it wouldn't have made any sense to re-sign Lin at a much higher price than for Felton, only to have him backup Felton.Yes, our plan was to use Lin as a trade asset, but we would have been stuck for a whole year before trading him, had we obtained him through matching. Meanwhile, it would have been unfair to leave Woodson to have to explain to the fans, for the entire year, why Lin is relegated to playing just garbage minutes behind Felton, since Felton and Carmelo will play in tandem for 40 minutes. Beside, Lin playing the role of a garbage-minute scrub would have drastically devalued him as a trade asset.
Right on point. Actually, that is exactly what Grunwald tried to explain to James Dolan. Thanks for saying it clearly here.
Wow.. great post!
Of course Felton will play less than 40 minutes (28 to 32 average?) - I just said that to keep it shorter (in case the Hater Unknown nit picks). But Carmelo's playing time will be quiet high, as one would expect.
Response to: ztrtaNice of you to try to clean up how the Knicks handled Lin's free agency. If the scenario is as you've written, then perhaps you can answer:1. Why would Woodson say publicly Lin would be the starting PG, if all along their plan was to use him only as backup? A lie?2. If the Knicks felt no team would give Lin an offer, then why did the Knicks go thru the trouble to announce to the world they would match any offer, even up to one billion dollars? A lie?3. If the plan was Lin as backup, then why was it announced Kidd would be mentor AND backup to Lin? A lie?4. If Lin was not in the team's future plans, then why would Dolan feel betrayed or even care if Lin left? A lie? 5. If your explanation is true, then why did Dolan tell Lin not to rush back for the playoffs because Dolan had big plans for him? A lie?6. If Lin was to be backup all along, then why the last minute rush and hide-and-seek with the Rockets to get more time to get Felton on board? A lie?7. If this was truly a business decision, then why the undeserved ugly smear campaign and spread of twisted story lines to put Lin in a bad light? More lies?8. And what is your source for this side of the Knicks' story or is this only your opinion?
All I can say for now is that you're very naive - or very young? They are an educated opinion, based on facts, so I will answer every question soon.I'm eating my late supper. I'll answer you ASAP.
That's one conspiracy theory. I doubt that's what happened. Dolan just got trumped and didn't like it. He got rid of Lin. Simple as that.
Here's the most complete answer to Jetaime's 8 questions:Answer: The New York Knicks were happy having Lin as their starter at the original 5/5/9/sortof9 offer, but they released Lin at the 2nd 5/5/15 offer that Lin is currently being paid by the Houston Rockets.
Hi Jetaime .... I had to work hard to answer Qs #2 and #3 because it's more complicated and since it's harder in writing. Therefore, I wanted to research and provide you with links for your perusal.... Feel free to disagree with my opinions, but I hate going too much back and forth..... If you want proofs for the other answers, research them yourself by typing the key words from my answers (as they were all EASY and quickly done from my head).... Any links that I provided, for some answers, it's important that you pay attention to the DATE of the article to make sense..... Well, here are my answers:>> 1. Why would Woodson say publicly Lin would be the starting PG, if all along their plan was to use him only as backup? A lie? Yes, a LIE. Many people knew it was a lie (because of his previous plans and remarks). I was going to explain more nut don't need to because it was proven when they went after Nash from *the second* (12:01 AM ET, July 1, 2012) the free agency began. Do you think Nash is a backup material? Is that why so many big-market teams offered him a big contract? (Kniks, Raptors, and including the contending Lakers). >> 2. If the Knicks felt no team would give Lin an offer, then why did the Knicks go thru the trouble to announce to the world they would match any offer, even up to one billion dollars? A lie?Yes LIE (just look at the outcome!). The answer for this Q was contained within my original post. They did that to ward off the competition. The $billion thing was just a figure of speech - and again, it was to scare off the competition (due to a rule, they knew that the contract that the Rockets gave him was the maximum that any team could offer). They have money, but there is hard cap, after which teams may spend zero dollars. Also, luxury tax is getting more prohibitive. That is a well known and common sense ploy for restricted agents, except that the team lied and lied continuously and sporadically throughout THE WHOLE free agency agency period up until the moratorium on signing was lifted on July 11th (but the Bulls weren't that shady to Asik; the Pacers weren't that deceptive to Hilbert.... their teams said they'll match but didn't say it repeatedly, and the Pacers did match per their word).I just came across the following article for the first time today (in trying to put together the answer #3)..... If they were reluctant to offer $24 million for 4 years (and the 4th year isn't even required), they weren't really planning to match "anything": http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8121358/backloaded-offer-jeremy-lin-give-new-york-knicks-pause-re-sign-sources-saySources: Jeremy Lin return uncertain ESPN The Magazine July 2, 2012 "While it may be doubtful that a club goes as high as $15 million in a season for Lin, even if one offered Lin roughly $10 million in the third and fourth years of a contract, the Knicks would be cautious about matching, according to a source." [As early as July 5th, it's been widely known that Lin had verbally agreed to sign with the Rockets, in which the 3rd and 4th year was $9.3 mil.... Is it not "ROUGHLY $10 Million ??]http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/free_agent_market_calls_for_linsanity_SCwaQXW6q2WKZe1TVdfAkLKnicks GM Grunwald plans to let market set Lin's price tag June 30, 2012"According to people familiar with the Knicks’ strategy Grunwald can offer him a maximum four-year deal starting at $5.5 million with 7 percent raises — a package worth $24.5 million. Don’t expect it. Grunwald will see if Lin gets an offer in that neighborhood as the first"." Plus, a team may not want to waste time with Lin since the Knicks have been vocal about matching any offers."
>> 3. If the plan was Lin as backup, then why was it announced Kidd would be mentor AND backup to Lin? A lie?(Did they had to lie? NO need to lie on this one). Felton *and* Lin *both* could have started over Kidd, but likely Felton would have because Carmelo and Woodson liked him... and it wasn't until the free agency approached that they brown-nosed Lin with "you are our starter". Logically, Kidd COULD STILL HAVE MENTORED LIN with Felton on board as well. Kidd was acquired *after* the Nash deal fell though. After losing out on Nash, they needed a deeper bench at the position. There were also a number of articles where Nash and Felton were mentioned at the same time, so looking back, I feel that Felton was their plan B all along for the STARTING PG (after plan A Nash). I truly think that they thought they had Nash: Nash went on a radio and said money was one of the important facto, so they offered him a lot of money; and they were devastated and Carmelo himself helped recruit Nash and he mentioned that he thought for sure that Nash was a Knick. http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/steve-nash-traded-to-lakers-knicks-must-look-elsewhere-1.3821335Steve Nash traded to Lakers; Knicks must look elsewhere July 4, 2012 Updated: July 5, 2012 "The Knicks, who tried to execute a sign-and-trade for Nash Wednesday, are expected to up their pursuit of Jason Kidd *AND* Raymond Felton." [They always remind that Newsday is owned by Dolan]http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-07-05/news/32555235_1_raymond-felton-sign-free-agent-mike-d-antoniSource: Knicks favorites to sign free-agent Felton July 05, 2012 "The Knicks are favorites to sign Raymond Felton, a source close to the free agent point guard told the Daily News. Having lost out on their primary free agent target Steve Nash and with Jeremy Lin possibly signing an offer sheet with the Houston Rockets, the Knicks are committed to adding Felton... Felton could be used as either a *STARTER* OR back-up with the Knicks, who are expected to re-sign Lin "http://tracking.si.com/2012/07/05/new-york-knicks-raymond-felton-portland-trail-blazers-nba/ July 5, 2012 "If the Knicks are in fact able to retain Lin and sign Felton, head coach Mike Woodson would have to decide whether to insert the young but promising Lin into the starting lineup or go with the more seasoned veteran. Felton HAS BEEN a STARTER FOR MOST OF HIS CAREER since being selected FIFTH OVERALL by the Charlotte Bobcats in the 2005 NBA Draft."
>> 4. If Lin was not in the team's future plans, then why would Dolan feel betrayed or even care if Lin left? A lie?NOT a lie (You are so frustrating! YOU ARE ASSUMING that NO LIE MEANS NO DECEPTION !!! Or NO ULTERIOR MOTIVE !!). BUT his future plan was to use him for a trade chip because Carmelo and Woodson didn't mesh well with him. And, since they didn't offer him a modest contract first (other than the qualifying offer), he was stuck with thinking about matching the backloaded contract that would have been prohibitive in the 3rd year (because of the three players' fat contracts that last for 3 more years), and the 2 biggest contracts are deemed untradable anyway, even *if* they wanted to.>> 5. If your explanation is true, then why did Dolan tell Lin not to rush back for the playoffs because Dolan had big plans for him? A lie?NOT a lie (You are frustrating with the "A lie?" after EACH Q.... Again, a truthful statement can't ever have an ULTERIOR MOTIVE ???). If he was a "damaged good", what kind of a trade asset would he be?>> 6. If Lin was to be backup all along, then why the last minute rush and hide-and-seek with the Rockets to get more time to get Felton on board? A lie? [KEEP IN MIND that this occurred in Mid July because they had 3 days to match as of July 14, 2012]I believe that once they didn't get Nash, they knew they were going to sign Felton, but signing F earlier would have revealed their true plan to the Lin camp, which they didn't want to do (because they wanted BOTH Felton *and* Lin at THAT TIME). And they wanted to have the bird (Felton) ABSOLUTELY in hand by having him sign at the dotted line because at that late in the game, Felton was about the only available starting PG left. They knew for certain that they could get the bird, but they wisely took the extra precaution.http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/agenda_points_pWapHgBq50242QTSiDi4pLKnicks to target Blazers' Felton if Suns' Nash passes July 1, 2012 "Steve Nash would be wonderful. Raymond Felton would be realistic.""Nash is the best candidate to lift Stoudemire out of last season’s funk, but Felton also is on their radar and is more attainable.""Felton made sweet music with Stoudemire on the pick-and-roll in Mike D’Antoni’s Knicks offense in the first half of the 2010-11 season.""But The Post reported yesterday Grunwald won’t offer Lin the maximum, early-Bird-rights contract of $24 million over four years, waiting to see if another team gives him an offer sheet first."http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/agent_felton_would_love_garden_return_bvTqjSIWhRHMl6TP6fduhOLast Updated: 10:21 AM, July 5, 2012 "Tony Dutt, agent for Raymond Felton, told The Post yesterday the ex-Knicks point guard would love to be back playing alongside Amar’e Stoudemire." [Now YOU TELL ME, is Amare a backup??? In order to play *alongside* Amare, Felton was to be the STARTER] "That scenario became closer to reality now that the Knicks were spurned by Steve Nash."“They’ve shown great interest, but there’s stuff they’ve had to get through,’ Dutt told the Post." [I wonder what "stuff" ???]
>> 7. If this was truly a business decision, then why the undeserved ugly smear campaign and spread of twisted story lines to put Lin in a bad light? More lies?Where did I say it was "truly a business decision" or anything close to it? To answer, because 1) They have asked Lin (via full court press) to do them the favor and give them a major discount, which he didn't bite (this was prior to winning early Bird rights; suggested taking $3 million per year and plug products -- this obviously would have made him a good trade chip, and it didn't require waiting a year. 2) By signing the backloaded contract, he had made it hard to match and also would have made him a much less desirable trade asset. Many people knew that they needed to get the divorce, but perhaps they are angry that they didn't get any divorce settlement out of it? > 8. And what is your source for this side of the Knicks' story or is this only your opinion?As you can see, it's based reading and watching the press (that is, facts). And because people don't wear deception and lies on their sleeve, for some things one must connect the dots, or infer, based on the available information. Info from the press or individuals are implications and *not always* spoon-fed in minute details. I wouldn't have and couldn't have formulated my opinions or stated facts if I hadn't kept up with the issue. So can be hard having to explain to some people.
excellent answers ztrta!
vmax71,Thank you, coz I'm a slow typist! chuckle hahahaha. And did it with 5 hours of sleep.Cheers,
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ztrts,Great answers.Regarding question #7, I think that the ugly smear campaign was to serve 2 purposes.1. A good excuse to cover up thier lies - because of Lin's disloyalty, they didn't have to keep their words about matching any offers. 2. To deflect the anger of Knicks fans. Although Dolan doesn't care much about what the fans feel or say, the Front Office still has to deal with it more or less. By the way, what Nash said on the radio almost sounded like a warning to Lin, "I think money in many ways represents respect. For example, if you sign with a team and take half or less money, six months later they trade you. Money has to be one of the factors. It's not everything but it is important and will be one of the factors involved."
JesLee,You're exactly right about both purpose. What I noticed was, whether in the get-Lin phase or ditch-Lin phase, the Knicks were so diabolical and selfish and tried to have it both ways; just pure greed, condescension and ill will towards Jeremy. That's exactly why players need representation. The ironic thing is, in both of those phases, things backfired on them.Therefore, I know that God was with Jeremy in dealing with the Goliath (I'm not a Christian, but I believe in one God).... As far as Steve Nash's comment: God often works through other people (be it so called "'coincidence" or words of wisdom), and Steve was simply answering questions posed to him, while he was promoting a charity event; the Knicks' mouth piece put the antenna out there, to figure out what would it take them to sign Steve. What they found out was that Steve is highly intelligent and articulate and that they can't fool him. Dolan is not a nice guy for sure. For some reason, I like Grunwald and I don't dislike Woodson. They all treated Lin crappy, but I feel like there was a chain of command.p.s. -- In my answers to 8 Qs, I used mostly *them* and *they* for Knicks; and *he* and *him* for Lin, in an attempt to avoid attracting too many folks like Unknown to my writeup.
ztrta, Thank you for taking the time to compose your response. It was a very comprehensive and insightful view into the whole NYK/Lin free agency fiasco.
You're welcome 3..... The credit goes to Jetaime, if you learned or read anything new: Jetaime asked some great questions on behalf of people who may not had as much time as I had, to read as many articles as I did (I work at home).Maybe he or some other people still might not be convinced, but I thought the writing was on the wall when the coach MD was compelled to resign, and soon, tell-tale comments started streaming out from the Knicks organization.
JLin and Chandler are an item now...
Jason Friedman tweeting some pictures from practice:More drill work before first practice begins ( @_ScottMachado, @JLin7, Toney Douglas and D-Mo) http://pic.twitter.com/hXXraUZBRockets bigs @TerrenceJones1, Greg Smith and D-Mo doing work before day 1 of camp officially begins pic.twitter.com/OZjsHhZw
Some training pictures from Jason Friedman's tweets:https://twitter.com/i/#!/HoustonRockets/rocketspersonnelor his direct tweet:https://twitter.com/RocketsJCFJust click on the view photos to see them.
Clutch has some nice videos posted:http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=7214704&postcount=1Main nba.com site has 3 videos as well. http://www.nba.com/rockets/video/2012/10/02/ZOOM0003MOV-2234797
not a whole lot of footage on jlin except for one typical jlin turnover - get up in the air with nowhere to go. old habits die hard i guess... also compared to what he looked like during the season last year, he's definitely not in mid-season form which is fine.. he'll get there. just look a step slow.everyone else is eh.. tony douglas is hitting his three's.. omer is huge. other than that looks exactly like a team playing together for the first time.
i'm guessing it's this one with jlin turnover:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I04BG8PUcaU&feature=player_embedded#t=95s
@fighton1999:"not a whole lot of footage on jlin except for one typical jlin turnover - get up in the air with nowhere to go."I watched the videos twice but I must have missed that. Would you mind telling me which video your referring to? Timecode please?Cause I see nice passes and also some nice alley hoop attempts. Its just a training day man... DAY 1!"also compared to what he looked like during the season last year, he's definitely not in mid-season form"Elaborate please... You really can tell from these short videos in what form he is? Have you also taken into consideration that JLin worked hard to losse 10 pounds without losing speed or strength?
dude don't get so defensive, plz. jlin is human after all and this IS the first day of camp. relax. there are plenty of videos on clutchfan... scrimmage part I at 1:37. if that's not a turnover i don't know what it. again, not a big deal like i said.. first day of camp and he hasn't played at nba speed pretty much since april. not in mid-season form because um.. it's not mid season? to my eyes (and go ahead and dispute that i don't really care) he looks a step slow. he normally gets by his man pretty easily.again.. not putting him down. don't be so defensive.
@JW:I hope its not what fighton1999 was referring to. Fighton1999 was talking about JLin going in the air with nowhere to go. Its like he expects JLin to spread his wings and fly to the hoop :) Maybe Im reading too much into it but it sounds like Fighton1999 is describing a desperate situation.What I see there is JLins attempt to lure some defenders away and fake a shot and pass to give Chandler Parsons (I think) an open shot. I would not consider this a typcial JLin turnover or a desperate situation. If you watch the old games... you will see that its one of many typical moves JLin uses to create opportunities for his teammates - it mostly works fine.I really dont like that JLin turnover discussion. Mostly its led by people who dont play bball. Look how he dribbles, thats how he loses the ball. Look how he passes, thats how he loses the ball. Croos court passes, thats how he loses the ball. When you play - you turn the ball over - especially when youre a PG. You know when that doesnt happen? When you play golf :) JLins turnover numbers werent that bad and one must realize that Knicks overall turnover numbers were bad - they were bad before and after JLin and that definitly ruined JLins stats. Cause - its not always the guy who passes who is responsible for the turnover...Of course he has his weak spots like when he is double teamed and forced into decision. But I dont see that in the videos. To see if he has improved in that matter we will have to wait until they play more seriously.
@willydilly,like i said - first day of camp. not a big deal to me (not even a deal for that matter). just pointing out that it IS a typical turnover and jlin himself alluded to that aspect of his game as one of the things he needs to work on. he got caught dribbling into traffic and tried forcing the pass to chandler. now, if they had played together a little more then maybe chandler would've anticipate the pass and cut to the open spot at the baseline instead of standing at the three and allowing his defender to get in the passing lane.and btw, i know you turn the ball over as a pg - i played pg throughout high school. and really, it IS a bad habit to do that, and it's not bashing lin to point that out.
@fighton1999:Dude - Im not getting defensive. Im just doubting your views. This is a fan site and Im rooting for my man. Nothing wrong about that - right?To your turnover thing - yeah - its a turnover. But that is not the point. The point is you saw it as "typical jlin turnover - get up in the air with nowhere to go". I simply see it differently and I elaborated that. BTW - you havent. You just backed down.You have to understand -> nagging without giving reason is basicly bashing and I dont like people bashing JLin on the JLin fansite. Im not defensive but please - dont feel offended or be offensive.About your midseason thing. Its exactly my point. I dont read too much into it but Im also not the one nagging. You are. The guys have just begun to play with each other. Its about getting to know each other and getting some routine. Of course they dont play that serious. Going from 0-60 on first training day will always result in injuries. I really dont know what you want. Nagging about JLin on a JLin fansite and claiming Im too defensive when Im just asking you to elaborate you views? What comes next?
About the TO -> you distribute the ball - youre getting the bad stats if your teammates dont get it right. Its not a bad habbit but its the nature of the game.If youre as much a JLin fan as I am and you have debated with haters as much as I have you would understand that haters too often use the TO discussion to bash JLin all the time. I admit it - I might be a bit sensitive when it comes to it. Also - english is my 4th language. I always try to be very clear and direct and sometimes people take it as agressive but believe me - Im not trying to offend anyone. Cheers
Not going to get into the discussion of "the turnover" with you guys. But I like what Lin's doing, especially in this kind of practice. Passing to teammates, seeing where they like the ball, building that chemistry. I mean, it's easy to dominate the ball and shoot and score, but I think he's already past the stage of just "fighting into the rotation" and doesn't need to really show off his scoring ability. We all already know that he can shoot, he can score as he's already done that in nba level.What I am most worried about is actually the play where Asik failed to catch an alley from Lin although he recovered at the end. I don't know if it's a matter of timing on Lin's part or Asik's lack of jumping ability that fail that play. But if it's with NY, Tyson would dunk the ball straight every single time and also I didn't see many alley oop plays from Asik in Chicago. The ability of catching a pass (or lack of) by Houston's big men is what I am most worried about.
@willy..pointing out what i am seeing is nagging? so we're never to talk about anything jlin does that needs improvement? this IS a fan site, right? We celebrate his accomplishments but also discuss other aspects of his game. that's a fan. i don't debate with haters because they don't know any better. i love my trojans but i don't pretend they're perfect. anyway, we can agree to disagree. you saw one thing i saw another. like i said, he has a habit of dribbling into traffic and improvising. in high school and ivy league he could get away with it but in the nba with the defense that these guys play, he'll need to be careful about that. That was my elaboration in my earlier post.. not sure you got that.what do i want? well my intent was to summarize what i saw in the videos from a jlin's fan's point of view. that's all. what do i want? i want jlin to one of the best players ever. what do i want? i want to be able to objectively talk about jlin as a person and as a basketball player, without fear of being called a blind homer or in the other extreme, a hater.
There were no TOs by Lin in those videos. Lin had an almost TO, but the other side never gained possession and in the scramble, Lin's side scored.Aside from that, Lin had 2 assists, one semi-assist on a lob where Asik missed the first layup but got the put back, and one pass to a hesitant shooter who waited to take a contested jumper. There is no way you can reasonably say he didn't play well in these videos, but I can tell that people are afraid of seeming overly in love with Lin's game, so are overcompensating. Lin's team scored in 4 of 5 offensive possessions where he was running the point. If he plays that way all season, well, not to put too fine a point on it, but he'd be the best player in the NBA. ;)Lin is going to make lots and lots of TOs this season. Many will be hideous. If you don't look at aggregate production you're just being silly. Although I see this silliness a lot.
lin to chandler! 1:24http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xq5wyYj-Y4
Thanks for the videos :Din truth who impressed me the most was the other jeremy :D Lin is not in good shape at all that's what mchale was talking about and i wouldn't be much worried. Let's wait a couple of weeks and pre season game... It was just training so anyone could do some risky pass or silly things.
I got a better idea, how about we wait until about 10 games into the regular season before we start giving out hand jobs... Trying to analyze a day of scrimmage is just about the most retarded things I've ever come across on, lol...
I especially like the same Rockets fans on the Rockets board who dismissed Lin last year's performance as "small sample size" are now complaining about Lin's performance based on these few minutes of practice. Lol. I guess haters gonna hate no matter what.
I knew a guy that watched a young Charles Barkley in training camp. He said that Barkley was the worst player at the camp. Barkley was unmotivated, unathletic, and unspiring. Then Barkley went out and had a typical Charles Barkley MVP type of season. Every year, training camp is filled with veterans like Barkley and likely Lin who are simply unable to muster the kind of energy needed to play their best in training camp. Then when the whistle blows in the regular season, players start playing FOR REAL. The hits get harder, the defenses get tighter, the gameplans get more sophisticated, and the fresh young rookies get worn down. Jeremy Lin appears to be having a typical veterans practice. Once the games starts, then he'll be just fine.
Based on a few minutes of scrimmage in training camp (yes just based on these few minutes), I predict that Jlin will continue to be turnover-prone this season and it will be a source of discussion and angst amongst Rockets fans. I honestly hope I'm wrong.
See 3 posts up :D
I actually wouldn't mind if Lin leads the league in turnovers next year. That means he's actually creating all the time. He just couldn't help if his teammates are unable to catch his passes. Turnovers in some ways are actually sign of being an elite PG.
I know what you meant, Cara but I wouldn't go too far for hoping JLin to lead in TOs :) The media is always more about perception than reality so he could lead Houston to the playoffs but the haters would just harp on the TOs.
Mr Screwup, you have a FUNNY way of showing your optimism!Don't worry. Fans are going to criticize Lin for turnovers even if he doesn't have any. So you needn't worry about negativity because it'll be there 100% no matter what!The other thing is that Rajon Rondo, Steve Nash, and Deron Williams are turnover machines in the NBA. If Lin joins them, that's saying something!
@Khuang, I'm not an optimist, I'm a realist.Rondo, Nash and Williams have a career Asst/TO ratio of 3, 2.96 and 2.875. Chris Paul is a crazy 3.92.Lin's ratio is 1.74. No sugarcoating it. His turnovers are a problem.
Lot's of people who are wrong think they're just being realistic. When you say his TOs are a "problem", you mean you expect him to be a top 15 player in the league in his first 25 starts? Then good on you. But last year, with a terrible TO "problem" (similar to other scoring PGs like Westbrook), he had a top 40 PER and top 40 adjusted +/-.Also, as I outline above, the box score from this scrimmage doesn't support your claim.I think Lin will always have a TO problem. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he leads the NBA in TOs this year. He was turnover prone at Harvard, too, but led them to their first Ivy title in decades (or ever?). Some people seem to have an aesthetic revulsion to TOs. The ONLY thing that matters is winning. Both of the Knicks longest streaks of above trend play last year, Linsanity and Lin under Woodson, Lin was running the point. No reasonable person can deny Lin's affect on winning basketball.Focusing on TOs out of context is really dumb.
You want to get technical? OK. Stats spinner.Multiply and extrapolate Lin's numbers, as well as NYK stats numbers, while Lin was a starter & given the offensive freedom that those guys get... to the amount of time those have gotten.If you want to look even smarter, then take into account Lin's putting a bunch of scrubs on his back doing it... as basically a rookie.win/loss +/- TS% yada yada yadaThen come back here, after you stop acting stupid.The end.
I'm happy to see Lin will always have his loyal fanboys. I'm just glad none of you are advising him basketball-wise cause he'll never improve if he thinks his TOs are actually a good thing. LOL.
I'm not glad you have ignorant, dense, blind people like you. =D
@MrScrewup - You're taking things out of context.Nobody said "his TOs are actually a good thing" and left at that. What they are saying (except Cara's comment didn't quite came out the way it was meant - Sorry Cara, LOL) - correctly - is what Michael Terry said it so well: "The ONLY thing that matters is winning" and "Focusing on TOs out of context is really dumb." Because pro team competition is all about winning! That shouldn't be so hard to understand.
Actually Mr Screwup, I'd agree that the turnovers would be a problem if he were still playing with those tanking teammates on NY. But now that Lin hopefully has players that aren't trying to deliberately lose games by refusing to do their jobs. I would imagine that Lin can improve his turnovers. I'm different from you in that I don't worry about turnovers. Actually, I worry about the other guards in the NBA who don't turn the ball over but flit aimlessly on the perimeter without making anything happen. At least Lin is trying to make plays, which is what guys with his All Star talent should be doing.
A good insight from Rockets' assistant coach, Kelvin Sampson, on JLin's strength and challenge plus other rookies and starting 5QA nba.com/rockets/news/qa-kelvin-sampson "JCF: You had Jeremy Lin in for the abbreviated training camp last year, but do you almost have to rediscover his game as well?KS: Absolutely. I was watching tape on him yesterday – I watched New York and Dallas – and Jeremy had such incredible freedom; he was their offense when he was on the floor. They put him in pick-and-rolls, they’d screen him and then re-screen him. He would attack the rim and if he could get to the rim he did, and if not he’d kick out and they’d play. With us, we’re going to give him some freedom because obviously he’s good at that, but we’re also going to have rules in our transition offense that he’s going to have to learn so it’s going to be interesting to see how he picks those things up.I think the biggest challenge for Jeremy is going to be taking care of the ball and being able to defend bigger, stronger, quicker, more athletic point guards. He’s got to get tougher in those areas. So Jeremy’s got some work to do but the thing I love about him is you look forward to coming in every day with him. Some guys will work grudgingly but Jeremy is a willing worker. He’s been tremendous to work with."
My interpretation is Jeremy will be given the same freedom to run the offense like in NY-Dallas game plus the transition offense in pushing the ball quickly to leverage the youth.And I won't read too much into his comment about JLin's biggest challenge to take care of the ball as being TO-prone. All PGs face the same challenge to take care of the ball, especially when he handles the ball i.e. Steve Nash, Jeremy Lin during Linsanity run. As long as you can outscore the opponent and win the game, he can have 6-10 TOs like Nash does.
I don't think he'll be getting as much freedom at all. I thought KS said it pretty clear that Lin gets "some freedom" but in NY, Lin had "incredible freedom." Lin will in time get the same freedom because he is the real deal. He first has to win over this team and its coaches. They are not sold on him yet. D'Antoni might have been playing politics at the end in NY by playing Lin like the next coming of Nash, although Lin performed under those circumstances. However McHale said they want to mask Lin's weaknesses and max out his strengths. To that end, Lin should be given some form of "incredible freedom" to just go make plays off screen and roll. However, that will only work so long before it gets old too and the entire league catches on. I'd rather see a couple other guys handle the ball as well to re-direct the point of attack as much as I like seeing Lin with the ball 95% of the time. I think it's better for Lin to play a more structured game at this time in his career although he might actually struggle at first but it will make him more efficient and deadly player in the long run.
I sure as heck am GLAD that Lin doesn't have to beat teams all by himself anymore. Lin had to make crazy plays in New York because he was usually the only guy on the court that could put the ball on the floor and score without assistance. Even Carmelo Anthony meekly deferred to Lin's creativity. If Kelvin Sampson can talk about Lin being more conservative, that means that the rest of the Rockets are not completely incompetent. Thus Lin can play a more FOCUSED game because he doesn't have to essentially pass the ball to himself to score.I'm encouraged at everything I'm hearing. The Rockets expect more out of Jeremy Lin than the Knicks ever did!
I know it could be insane but i think they could get a playoff spot... It will take some time to settle but they can get that. Lamb looks great maybe d-mo could play with Asik, 2 giants in the paint, plus chandler .... And who knows who will come during the season? My fav team has been penny's magic but i really hope this rockets team can steal my heart :D
yes, you're right about "some freedom", not "same freedom". I got dyslexic while reading :)I actually thought Mike Woodson had at least one right idea on how to use Lin's strength and mask his weaknesses. For me, one of the most impressive games by JLin is the 3/21 NY road game against Philly, Lin did not play well (4-14FG, 0-3 3PT) but Woodson's trust paid off when he scored his 16 out of 18 points in the 4th quarter. He scored the last 10 pts for NY with a perfect 10-10. His teammates only scored 7 points in that 4th quarter (1 assist from JLin to Melo). Most impressively, his perfect free throws was so demoralizing to the 76ers that they had a brain freeze in the last few seconds to not foul and get another 3PT attempt. Knicks won 82-79. Their body language said "why fouling again? Linsanity made the last 10 free throws. He's gonna make them anyway". Doug Collins was so frustrated with his players.Mike Woodson knew JLin's strength and trusted him enough that even when he didn't shoot well, he trusted him in the crucial moment in the 4th quarter to keep attacking the basket, create plays and made his free throws. This is the greatest testament of Woodson's trust in JLin. And JLin only had 2 TOs in the game.I believe Coach Woodson was being conservative and mask JLin's weakness (rookie PG and rookie ball handlers) by not to always bring up the balls and create plays all 4 quarters because Jeremy also admitted making "lazy" pass when he got tired. So he protected JLin from making too many TOs unnecessarily and preserved his energy for 4th quarter.But Woodson also knows how to maximize JLin's strength but putting the ball in his hands in the crunch time.I hope Houston coaches stole a page from Coach Woodson's book on how to use JLin. I agree that there needs to be multiple ball handlers to bring up the ball in the first 3 quarters to preserve JLin's energy and prevent TOs due to fatigue but they better put the ball in Jeremy's hand in the 4th quarter because he can create plays.
Dunno if there are enough assist-men in the team: one of the weaknesses of lamb is he just think about shooting, royce white? Naaa, K-mart maybe machado who knows how much he'll play.... It's all on jlin's shoulders there aren't good pgs in the team. They can score yes but they can't create
Chandler Parsons is an excellent passer. Even in college he racked up a lot of assists (4apg his senior year). In fact, check out this clip from today:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqql303-opQ&feature=player_embeddedLin entry feed to Parsons, who has a behind-the-back bounce pass to Asik. Dunk!
Speaking of a "lower usage" approach, I think Jeremy's best post-Linsanity game was the St. Patrick's Day game against Pacers (good defensive team who were familiar with Lin from the day before).Jeremy had only 10 FGA against Indiana but racked up 19 pts, 6 assists, 7 rebs, 1stl, 1blk, 2to. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=De7M701rzf8
Psalm:I agree with you that Mike Woodson used Lin well and also your Philly game assessment. I liked Lin's mentality in that game and how he was employed and carried through a victory. It boggles my mind so many people think Lin sucked after D'Antoni left. I think most people stopped caring after the losing streak and then MDA's resignation. Did you know SAS pointed out that Philly game as evidence that Lin is a marginal mediocre player? SAS jumped on Lin's subpar shooting stat line and said Lin was hogging all the shots and that's why Lin scored all the points in the 4th quarter and nobody got to touch the ball. And SAS said Lin's ballhogging misses were why the game was so close when it should have been a easy Knicks' win.I've never believed Lin is a 25-30 ppg kind of guy. I think he can be that if that is all a coach wants from him. He could be an Asian Jason Terry....But I think Lin is more so a 14-18 pt kind of guy at the NBA level who gets 6-8 assts, with 4-7 rbs, 3-4 steals, and .5 blocks, jack of all trades type of guy who will make uncanny/sometimes lucky clutch plays while doing those little things time and time again that win games. I think Lin will come to epitomize the "clutch" moniker in Houston even if he isn't leading scorer and/or the face of this franchise down the line.
That's definitely craziness :) SAS is the definition of provocateur and CAA defender. We know if Melo and JR did what JLin did to carry the team on his back and made 10FT with poise, SAS would sing a different tune praising Melo as the savior of NY.Both teams shot poorly in that game and Philly got into a hot shooting streak in the end but still couldn't hack-a-Lin to cut into the lead.For an interesting look, compare the +/- in this game with the previous Philly-NY game 10 days earlier where both Amare and Melo sat in the 4th quarter in 106-94 loss. Date Game Result Melo Amare Lin3/11 Phi 109-94 win -16 -12 -23/21 NY 82-79 win +1 -3 +8This is why I like the +/- stat. It really shows who don't play defense. It's not perfect but I've been looking at some interesting numbers that I'll share later on.
>Chandler Parsons is an excellent passer. Even in college he >racked up a lot of assists (4apg his senior year). In fact, >check out this clip from today:>>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pqql303->opQ&feature=player_embedded>>Lin entry feed to Parsons, who has a behind-the-back bounce >pass to Asik. Dunk!Not to downplay the excellent passing but did Asik travel during the play?
I can't seem to see Royce White in these scrimmage videos. Can anyone help me out?
I found the answer to my question: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/8459655/
Seriously Royce White, a grown man is afraid to fly in an airplane ?? This is the NBA, there are going to be many cross country trips during the regular season .... and he's getting paid serious $$ to travel to these important games.Remember how they got Mr. T on the airplane in old 80's show "The A-Team"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRUS6QBiViQ royce white anxiety disorder