Pros : -help the team, no matter how minimally. Can't do worse than a beaten-up BD or the other two guards; -gain some valuable playoff experience, against one of the top teams no less; -who knows, might just shake off the rust and spark a win.
Cons: -high risk of re-injury because the Heat will want to take him out of the equation straightaway, so they can return to defending Melo and Stat. They'll play hard and dirty, as playoff games tend to be. Might even be career-threatening; -risk of injuring some other part of the body; -rusty play resulting in sky-high TOs and ineffective defense/offense puts a dent on his reputation; -he himself expressed some concern about disrupting the team chemistry (it's really about disrupting Melo's iso game since that's what it's boiled down to).
Overall, I think it's just not worth it. Come back stronger next season. In any case, Melo sounded like he really didn't want JLin back now when he said he looked forward to having JLin back on the team next season (i.e. not now). I won't be surprised if, as usual, he wants all the spotlight and be the hero, especially at this critical point. I say let him have it, let him earn his keep. And when the Knicks inevitably fall to the Heat (I don't like them but have to admit that they are really in another class of their own, having had a full season to gel and not having any injuries), no blame can be attached to JLin. But his not playing will only further cool Woodson's already cold attitude towards him, it's as if Woodson thinks he's malingering or something.
But somehow, I think the competitor in JLin will make him decide to come back. There'll certainly be a lot of pressure over the next few days.
Davis isn't just beaten up; he's out. That's the key difference in the public's perception of whether Lin should man up and suit up for Game 5. If Davis was available for Game 5, the spotlight wouldn't be on Lin to return. The risk of Lin disrupting the team's chemistry with Davis at PG is no longer a consideration; the large gap left by Lin, Davis, and Shumpert in the rotation is the greater concern.
By Wed, Lin will be less than 1 week from his projected return date, the Knicks have added hope with the Game 4 win, and their guard situation is critical. Those factors don't raise the expectation that Lin should play well, heavy minutes, or make the Knicks the favorites, but they do raise the expectation that a genuine team leader would take the initiative to make himself available for the sake of the team.
Under the circumstances, the greater danger to Lin's long-term reputation isn't playing badly. The greater danger is the perception Lin cared more about himself than the team, and he held back in an all-hands-on-deck situation when he could have tried to play, when his team needed him to act like the leader he's supposed to be.
All this "man up" garbage is just that, garbage. They still have Douglas and Bibby, if anyone should "man up" it should be those two, not someone who's injured, that's ridiculous.
This is not some life and death situation, enemy troops aren't rushing the base and everyone must fight injured or not or risk death. This is basketball.
JLin's name was enough to raise MSG's stocks by 32% this year, because their revenue killed estimates due to him. Regardless if he comes back or not they are not getting rid of him.
You know I just had a dinner and some drinks with a bunch of long time diehard Knicks fans...In Phillie of all places. ALL THEY TALK ABOUT IS JLIN, and how proud they were when they all showed up at the Sixers game wearing Knicks jersey. Melo isn't even in the conversation, except when they talk about what a douchbag move it was on his part to oust D'Antoni. Real fans sees this: Melo will never replace JLin as long as JLin wears a Knicks jersey. We all know he can score, but he's not the star he thinks he is...He's trying to pass himself off as Kobe/LBJ quality, not even close.
Team leader? Haven't Woodson made it clear enough that Melo and STAT are the team leads? Do you need a rock star PG to continue feeding the ball to Melo's iso game? What would that actually accomplish? Role players like Novak still ain't going to get the ball, its all about Melo then STAT. JLin returning now at this time isn't going to change this.
So why have him come back now when he can be stronger next season, and not risk injury, especially with Knicks pathetic medical staff? IMO I agree he should go to Suns if Knicks won't keep him, fat chance that'll happen though.
We shouldn't using a one-dimensional approach to assess the possibility of Jeremy playing in game 5. It isn't just about gender = women being weaker and men being men should be macho and insist on fighting a losing battle. We are talking about the pros and cons if Jeremy takes the court without being 100% healthy, spoiling the chemistry of the team, etc, etc.
R_U_Sure, there's no reason to interject sexist remarks like that to make a point. You should know better, especially in a forum where we constantly discuss how Jeremy was marginalized, belittled and ignored because of his ethnicity.
I'm not interjecting anything but saying the NBA is on a whole nother level than the WNBA.. Why did you guys assumed that I said anything bad about women??? My mother is a woman, relax...
The NBA isn't co-ed and Lin's teammates are all men. In general and for fans, platonic values of manhood characterize men's sports, or any male-dominated competitive arena for that matter (such as the military, which shares values with sport). For Lin, those platonic values of manhood inform the relationships within his particular competitive tribe of men.
Teams that don't hew to platonic male values are likely not the good teams.
It's quite clear to everyone what you meant, R_U_Sure, so don't try to act so smug and indignant when someone calls you out on it. You and your buddy Eric are of the opinion (whether consciously or subconsciously) that women can't be as competitive as men and can't form the kind of comradery necessary to excel at a team sport like basketball. You believe this even though the WNBA as a whole averages more assists per 100 possessions than the NBA (5.25 vs 4.55). So it doesn't matter how much work and sweat these women put in, it doesn't matter how much they dominate their respective opponents, in your world view it will never be enough to prove to you that they are competitors in their own right. Does this sound familiar to you?
What R_U_Sure meant, as I understood it, is that the NBA is a league of men, paternalistic, tribal, and competitive by design, and Jeremy Lin will be judged for his decision as a man by the men of his tribe (his team) and the league. The NBA, indeed, is not the women's NBA. It's the men's NBA where Lin will be judged as a man by men.
Those of us who have been part of similar communities understand the implications for his reputation of Lin's decision.
The WNBA is a great league where the women are just as tough and professional as their male counterparts.
Any WNBA professional faced with the same situation as Lin would do what he's doing: try to tough her way back into playoff games.
I stand with Aids Bike on this one. Jeremy Lin faced discrimination for being Asian. I certainly won't discriminate against female WNBA players either.
I have not attended a Suns or Mercury game here in Phx yet. But there's a high likelihood that I go see the Mercury before I see the Suns!
@Aids Bike, Calm your ass down, you're comparing WNBA assist to the NBA?? I can compare any statistics NBA>WNBA and get a far greater number, heck it shouldn't even be in the same discussion.. Why are you so offended??? You're on the internet and you seemed so butt hurt over a comment I made about NBA being better than the WNBA, lol.. It was you who insinuated that women are weak and can't compete with men.. You are the one who had to go farther than what my comment was intended for..
The NBA may play better basketball than the WNBA, but that does not mean the players sacrifice themselves any less.
Pro sports are pro sports. Jeremy Lin will do his best to play, jusy like the pros of the WNBA do night after night. Most of the WNBA players even play year round, as the players play in overseas leagues and then come to the WNBA for the offseason.
I do not see the WNBA as any less of a league than the NBA, though obviously the women cannot compete against the men. When I watch WNBA games, I see the same toughness and professionalism that the NBA demonstrates.
That said, Woodson should heavily curtail his minutes and bench Lin the instant he falters.
The playoffs are a critical learning experience for Lin. Even playing the grand total of 2 minutes in Game 5 would be enough to give Lin a taste of playoff basketball.
Yes! I want him to experience this playoff. Even for just 2 minutes, pls. I'm so desperate to see him playing again. I feel like I'm wasting money for NBA League Pass ( if I don't see him playing before the end of this season). I prayed that they win on game 4 because I want to see him in game 5. But God is the only one who knows what is good for Jeremy, I'm still praying everyday for his speedy recovery and I'm praying that he will comeback stronger and lead the knicks again next season. I'm forever Jeremy's fan and I will follow him wherever he go, for better or worse I will support him until he retire.
ESPN are now openly questioning whether Lin is holding back for his contract. Driven of course by the sanctimonious and biased Stephen A Smith and his loyal sidekick Skip B. It's causing a bit of a stir on twitter. Good Lord. A few weeks ago, people were all "Jeremy who?" and now it's "Lin must play of else?" It's crazy the amount of craziness Jeremy inspires.
They peddle tabloid sensationalism and stir up manufactured controversy to promote their increasingly idiotic "brand identity" and the BSPN sports empire.
Stephen A Smith is a tool...First he's like "Melo is gawd Lin sucks he should be traded" now he's like "Lin is holding back for contract" like Lin is all the sudden important in his eyes? LOL...
I'm glad Woodson and Carmelo don't put pressure publicly for Jeremy to play or be the hero in Game 5.
http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7900540/2012-nba-playoffs-new-york-knicks-not-expecting-jeremy-lin-back-game-5 "We'll gauge it today and tomorrow, but I'm not counting on Jeremy Lin to play," Woodson said on a conference call Monday.
I think the Knicks will start Bibby and has Toney Douglass come off the bench. They will only put Jeremy in the 2nd or 3rd quarter if the game is getting out of hand and see if he can energize them with pick-and-roll and putting the ball in Melo, Amare, and Novak's hands. I think the strategy is smart to not expect much but treat him like a "secret weapon".
It looks like Amare and Jeremy have been practicing a lot of pick-and-roll as part of Amare's recovery process from this article: http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/18912/spo-on-stat-he-gave-them-a-little-punch Here's how Stoudemire described the recovery process after the game:
"The last few days I've just been practicing on it, seeing how it feels, trying certain braces for me to see how they felt in practice. Two days ago, I had a brace that felt OK. I was able to give it a little go. I was able to get up and down with Jeremy [Lin] and Toney Douglas to work on my pick-and-rolls and my catches and finishes. On Saturday, I was able to give it a go again and it was feeling better and better. So today, I felt even better. That's when I knew I was ready to play."
With Davis out, Jeremy will definitely play for 5-20 minutes. Who knows? Let's hope and pray that Jeremy's knees hold. Let the legend of Lin begin!
There's also something in the front of my mind that I want Lin to learn from playing this game.
For Lin to have a long successful NBA career, he needs to learn how to pick his spots.
I firmly believe that if Jeremy Lin is minimally healthy, he can play Game 5 and be very effective in a very conservative role. I want him to learn that he does not have to constantly overwhelm opponents with his athleticism in order to play well in the NBA.
True. If Lin is as versatile and smart a guard as we think he is, he should be able to contibute in different ways even if he's too rusty and out of shape to do all the things we're used to seeing from him.
Yes, perhaps Nash's style would be a good one to emulate? After all, he's still playing well when he's 38 years old.
Jeremy's style to attack the basket reminds me of DWade's style a few years ago but even DWade has adjusted since then. Otherwise, it must be really hard on the knees.
Maybe Lin will even do the "Isiah Thomas" and explode for 25 points in a single playoff quarter despite playing only on one leg?
I saw that game. It was like watching the final scene of "Better Off Dead" when John Cusack's character Lane Myers wins a ski race despite having only one ski!
I feel that if Jeremy does not play his image may get tarnished and some people may pour dirty wAter on him and calling him selfish only considering his health and career
Remember Woodson commented that some athletes played with the same injury jeremy had and people see how David and stat played with injuries, if knicks lose and Jeremy does not play, Knicks fans probably turn their angry towards Lin.
On the other hand, Jeremy Lin may turn on the heat again, the heat will want to send the message again: told you, we have seen Lin before, there will be no difference this time
Now thinking from this angle, I think Jeremy should play but be very cautious Because the heat really does not like Jeremy get anything
Just hope the heat do not do dirty play like the Jason Kidd and god is protecting jeremy
People who would criticize Lin for not playing are the same ones that criticize Lin for playing!
Jeremy Lin can protect Jeremy Lin by picking his spots to attack. It doesn't matter whether he's healthy or not, he has to slow his pace and play efficiently.
I am glad Jeremy Lin used his body as a battering ram to knock down NBA defenses in order to establish himself in the league. Michael Jordan did the same thing in his 2nd year and ended up missing most of the season.
Lin no longer needs to be a battering ram. He just needs to let the game come to him and adjust his pace downwards.
HE should PLAY. Don't care if he's rusty, the team NEEDS him after what happened to Baron Davis. HE NEEDS TO PLAY. If the doctor said that he can play, he should play. Really i'm a JLin fan since day 1 (before Linsanity) and I'll be really disappointed if he chose not to play. His team needs him more than ever right now. On top of that, its already been 5 weeks since the surgery. Most players return even sooner than that. He's been practicing for over a week and the game still isnt' until WED so he should have enough to prepare physically. I hope JLin isn't sitting out to protect his brand and to get a bigger contract. Also please make sure the doctor clears him first.
Besides, Lin isn't going to play many minutes anyway.
I'm actually more worried about Lin playing WELL than playing poorly. If he plays too well, he might throw a Jordan style hissy fit if Woodson benches him!
Lin is a Knick, and the Knicks are the franchise whose proudest moment is Willis Reed limping onto the court in Game 7 of the 1970 finals. There's a reason Reed's old Knicks teammates still reverently call him "The Captain". With Davis's injury, 5+ weeks since the surgery, a week of teasing fans about a possible return, and an elimination game, Lin's reputation will be judged far less on the Knicks winning or his playing high-level basketball (both unlikely) than what Lin shows the world as a competitor, leader, and role model - especially as a role model for Asian-American boys who ask, What Would Jeremy Do? Lin will be forgiven for faltering on the court, but he won't be viewed kindly for turning his back on his team under these circumstances.
Woodson's latest comments are clear: it's Lin's choice. If the doctors sign off and Lin says he wants to play, then Lin will play. However, barring re-injury to his knee in practice, if Lin wants to play Game 5, the team doctors won't be able to stop him.
If the young Lin aspires to be a respected virtuous leader among the men of the NBA, the right decision for him is to play in Game 5.
Listen to woodson's praise on David and bibbly And the way Woodson push the ball to Jeremy's hand If the doc gives the green light, Jeremy should tell the coach he will play And let the coach decide if he is good enough skill wise to play
It would hurt Jeremy really really bad if after a loss and some inside info leaked out Suggesting doc ok'ed but Jeremy held back
Another story of course if the doc says otherwise
With Landry field and Novak said Jeremy looks good, it's hard for Jeremy to convince people he is still to sore to play
It is very tricky, hope god gives Jeremy the wisdom to make the right decison
I don't agree at all that Jeremy Lin would be seen as turning his back on the team if he refused to play.
Unlike Lamar Odom who was perfectly healthy but was too swept up by his reality show to focus on his basketball duties, Lin is legitimately injured. He doesn't even have medical clearance yet.
Al Horford of the Hawks has been out far longer than Lin. He's thinking about playing, but nobody is pressuring him. If he chooses not to play, nobody will criticize him. And they won't criticizeLin either.
Asian American boys like me don't ask "What would Jeremy do?" We ask "How much does he make" or "How good can he be?"
Woodson said Jeremy is not in great shape for playoff basketball.
http://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/07/knicks-lin-has-hurdles-to-clear-before-a-return/?src=tp “I’ve watched him shoot and run up and down – he’s not in great shape,” Woodson said. “You know as well as I know that playoff basketball you’ve got to be at an all-time high and he hasn’t played in a while.”
I changed my vote to want to see him play but I won't think any less of him if he decides he can't play. He knows his body the most and realizes debilitating injury can happen any time. Baron Davis is the latest example. Also, I read somewhere meniscus tear is tricky because it can lead to microfacture surgery in the long-term.
Let's support him 100% no matter what happens in Game 5! And pray hard for his long-term health. I'd take 15-20 years of NBA career anytime over a remote possibility of a miraculous win in 1 playoff series. Wait, maybe I'll change my vote again...Man, I don't know what to think now.
Some analyst on espn says there is a 95% chance that Lin will play in game 5 because the Knicks are really pressing Lin hard to come back. I wonder how accurate that is? I really want to see him play but he will not be fully healed and rusty. I don't want the last game Lin plays this season to be a bad one.
"Jeremy Lin Shouldn't Play Unless He Can Play" http://nymag.com/daily/sports/2012/05/jeremy-lin-shouldnt-play-unless-he-can-play.html
Doesn't that look like Clark Kent's glasses? A Willis Reed moment would be Game 6 in NY. Jeremy should sit on the bench with his suit and glasses then go inside a phone booth and come out with his Knicks jersey ala Superman! The Garden would really be rocking :)
Has anybody checkrd out the anatomy of the meniscus and what it looks like? Very tiny little things that act as shock absorbers for your kneecap. Very fragile part. Its a wonder they stay in at all in your knee. Im no expert, but looking at images of them, they look like they can slip and slide and blowout at anytime. Now the weight you put on it on the court and in the playoffs is magnified exponentially. Isnt it true that in life, the little things you take for granted becomes a constant chronic problem if only we take the time to heal. While the bigger issues gets resolved because we make sure that it is done right the first time. I think in this case you need a fiduciary component that s gonna look out for the best interest of Lin. It is not the team, the coach the doctors or even Lin himself. It is his parents. Whatever they say goes. Hey that is so Asian but it works. Hows that for a different point of view?
Does anyone actually believe these Knicks even with Jeremy are going to be the only team in history to come back from 0-3 against this healthy Heat team? Seriously???
Hasn't anybody been watching what happened to Rose, Shump, and now Davis? Non contact injuries people. Jeremy could easily go down again and ruin his free agency run.
What free-agency run??? JLin isn't going nowhere. The Knicks have his rights this offseason to match what any other team can give him, which is $5.5 Million. That's the max. any team can give him.
Jeremy has to go for broke. It's no longer a matter whether he can help the Knicks win. It's about showing leadership and courage. Look at Stat playing with half his hand cut off, BD playing with a bulging disk and fighting to the end when he can no longer, same with Shump playing his hardest until he can't. Prior to his teammate's injuries it made sense he does not play. But it's different now. He has to be a fearless warrior and fight for his fallen team mates.
Theres a whole in your argument. Amare hurt himself foolishly, he has to come back for redemption..BD has been hurt all his career, nothing new. Shump is a rookie, no comment. Lin has already shown his fearlessness but postponing the surgery in order to prove his value during and prior to Linsanity.
leadership and courage was when he led them back to .500 instead of being down with a record of 7 wins and 23 losses.
it is ludicrous for uneducated fools like you to call out lin and state he has no leadership or courage when he hasn't even been cleared for 5on5 play. FOH.
"grow a spine"? how about you grow a brain? citing shumpert's injury is disingenuous, as he went down with a freak injury. citing baron is disingenuous as well, as he was shut down for almost a year while the knicks were tanking themselves out of the playoffs until lin saved them. and LOL at your amare self inflicted wound argument. FOH.
when a pussy like you learns what cutting and jumping actually means in basketball, let us know.
one more fact to put you in your place: chris paul missed at least 6-7 weeks when he went down with knee surgery, and looked like trash when he returned. are you trying to say chris paul is a wimp and lacks leadership and courage? there goes your idiotic argument. FOH.
I must have hit a nerve with leadership and courage, two characteristics you probably lack which explains why you react the way you do on this board. You attack others by citing how stupid they are. You just showed your true colors. You need to see a counselor for anger management. I have responsibilities and a job, so don't expect a reply.
LOL! yeah, notice bloggereng completely ducking the chris paul example because he can't overcome the stupidity of his own argument. posters like you deserve a verbal smackdown for idiocy. what happened? you can't call out chris paul for his lack of courage and leadership because it exposes your hypocrisy? take your idiotic "courage" argument and shove it.
also, you didn't hit a nerve, you just made it fun for me to check this website again during my work shift. now you're crying about me needing a counselor for anger anger management? don't confuse anger with pure joy of "making you my punching bag" (stole that from khuang haha). i guess we should have you institutionalized for sheer stupidity. try again, kid. continue ducking.
Jeremy Lin should go for broke if he's cleared to play. This is the NBA where guys that shouldn't be playing better not enter the game and hurt themselves and.their teams.
Jeremy Lin should also be very careful about coming back too soon. There are long term consequences to think about. Guys on losing teams routinely get shut down so that they don't jeopardize their health playing in games that will not lead to the playoffs. Kevin Love was shut down this year for that reason.
So stop your bickering, guys. You are ALL right. Use ME as your punching bag if you can't accept that.
Lin should just take the rest of the season off. There's no point in trying to come back now. He's never been in the playoffs, its much tougher physically/mentally, especially coming back from an injury. I certainly don't want to see him come back just to go back down in round 2.
If he's at 50% he might as well let Bibby/Douglas pull their weight. And no, he ALREADY showed enough leadership, its what got him injured in the first place, Jeremy has nothing to prove.
Besides, Knicks medical staff well, sucks. Honestly I'd rather see him go to Suns, especially the way he plays.
If Jeremy is to stay with Knicks and the doc says ok to play I think he should play Otherwise he will be marginalized If there is any conflict rising in the future his teammates would simply smack his dignity by one sentence: Where were you during the playoff against Miami heat?
Lin isn't just injured. He's out of shape, hasn't played in a long time, and has not been part of the team.
Everybody on the team sees Lin striving with all his might to come back. That is why nobody is calling him out the way the Mavs did with Lamar Odom who simply refused to play.
NBA player don't earn trust solely by what they do on the court. They prove themselves to each other off the court as well.
No way, Lin shouldn't be pressured into playing by rabid fans like us! Unless he can play aggressively like his usual self, what's the point of playing?
This is not pressure. This is the reality. Jeremy has to think through all the consequences. Of course, if the doctor says he can't play, it's another story.
It all boils down the assessment from the doctor I guess.
Even you cannot count on the doctors. Its all subjevtive as far as healing time. Some heal faster or slower. Only Lin knows, but he will have people pressure him. To be really fearless, you have to stick to your guns and not let anybody bully you to come back before yore ready.
as good a poster as you have been, Khuang, you just proved every human being has its dark side: that is have pleasure built on other's pain. you are talking about playing in a game that with very high probability of getting injured again or worse, which could put Jeremy out for good 8-12 months like Iman/Rose.
it also reveals a simple truth of American: instant gratification.
i can only shake my head...
if doctors clear him and he feel good, then do it. but if there is any risk, don't. period.
who cares about this stupid Knicks team? It is just reported that Woodson has had talk with Front office on returning as head coach. He WILL get it for sure, needless to say his buddy GM will love to keep him. Dolan is a clueless POS owner.
I would not want to see Jeremy in Knicks' uniform next year. this team is not suitable for Jeremy. He can learn same defensive skills and grow with other teams.
I think JLin can play about 6 minutes per half, and play safe. Shoot the open 3s like Bibby, and no need to attack the rim. It will be like rehab for him.
JLin has been doing a lot of shooting these days. He may be able to get hot and make a difference in the game. Both Bibby and Douglas have been shooting poorly all season long. He can play this game like a scrimmage. No need to go all out.
Actually, Brandon Roy had bad knees the instant he came into the NBA. Those knees were so bad that teams passed over him and Minnesota traded him away. Plus he played for Portland which has always been a franchise struck with career ending leg injuries. So his injury history was far worse than Lin's.
The saving grace is that Mike Woodson won't be tempted to leave Lin in the game too long. In fact, Woodson might not even play Lin at all even if Lin is medically cleared.
If there is a Game 6 and Lin plays, I'd be happy to see him for about 4 minutes total - one minute per quarter!
Hey unknown, Brandon Roy is trying to make a comeback.
Let him do it right here in Phoenix, where I am a reluctant homer. I have traditionally HATED watching the Suns because they play outside-in basketball, but I'm all for them getting players like Jeremy Lin and Grant Hill and Michael Redd.
Both Brandon Roy and Greg Oden should join Phoenix. The Suns have the legendary Aaron Nelson for trainer who's so good that he broke Channing Frye out of a shooting slumping by literally fixing his ASS.
How about this? Since the Suns have no desire to resign Steve Nash, how about the Knicks use the entire midlevel exception on Nash and let Lin go to the Suns. Acquire Brandon Roy and Greg Oden at minimum contracts and bring over Steve "I can't survive without Lin" Novak and Lamar "Sun Killer" Odom. Plug Lin into the starting lineup with Redd/Roy, Hill/Odom, Marcin Gortat at PF, and Oden at center. Let Aaron Nelson keep Lin injury free. See what happens.
i think the most appropriate outcome that if his doctors clears him to play, is to play a less aggressive, traditional role of PG, not the Steve Nash style of play, that will not over strain his repaired knee, and at the same time, still allow Melo to take on the superstar role.
Let's face it, knicks need a decent PG, that's the minimum that you need for now. Don't forget about Stats, Melo & steve Novak, etc.
Folks, it's never wise to make uninformed decision and in our case, an uninformed opinion. I was caught in the exuberance of watching "Jeremy Lin Playoff Moment" so I thought 4-5 minutes won't do any harm. I did a bit more research trying to put myself in his shoes or his parents. I changed my mind.
We only know about what the media reported about Jeremy Lin's injury and "politically correct" coaches and teammates who are not doctors and qualified to clear Jeremy to play intense playoff basketball. "He looks good to play in practice" is not good enough to play Jeremy in his first ever playoff game after not playing for over 5 weeks.
Imagine if you are Jeremy Lin or he is your brother asking for your opinion if he should come back soon. What would you say? Of course you would say health first, long-term career and nothing else matters.
There are so many important medical questions to answer first. 1. How serious is Jeremy Lin's meniscus tear injury? 2. What is the estimated recovery time? ~6 weeks? 3. Is there possibility to have a long-term injury if one comes back too soon? (i.e. Brandon Roy retired in 2011 after he came back to 2010 playoff series only 8 days after surgery of partial meniscus tear similar to Jeremy)
I didn't know these answers and I'm not sure we have all the information out there to find out. But with some digging, there are some gems out there. Sorry for the long post, but bear with me here.
1. How serious is Jeremy Lin's meniscus tear injury? http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/chandler_eager_to_represent_usa_JyARK993TvKsgLo3HJCBFL Because Lin had a “lateral’’ meniscus tear in his knee, it takes much longer to rehab than if it was a “medial’’ tear, according a person with knowledge of Lin’s situation. The Knicks originally did not disclose whether it was “medial’’ or “lateral’’. Lin hoped to beat the six-week timetable, but that isn’t happening as his knee swelled up after surgery.
So we know its a "lateral" (the band that ran on the outside of the knee) meniscus tear and it takes longer to rehab.
2. What is the estimated recovery time? According to the same article, the original six-week timetable recovery isn't happening because his knee swelled up after surgery. And we know he experienced soreness after playing one-on-one with an assistant coach last week. He tried hard to get ready but his body is not responding well.
3. Is there possibility to have a long-term injury if one comes back too soon? http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/09/26/nba-players-prone-to-serious-meniscal-tear/ This impressive study with 20 years of data reveals that NBA under-30 years old players suffered the more serious "lateral" meniscus tear than "medial" tear that normal people have. Brandon Roy reportedly has no cartilage left in either knees causing bones to rub each other and forced him to retire. It can cause arthritis in the long-term. While the 1 year performance using Hollinger PER shows the same result is interesting, it doesn't answer long-term implications. And there is a notion that a lateral tear is more serious and carries more long-term degenerative consequences.
What does this all mean? Those who took statistics class would say statistics can be misleading. I can even create a hypothesis that the reason why most lateral tear was on under 30-year old NBA players is because these players don't make it past 30 years old in the NBA. Brandon Roy was 27 years old when he retired in 2011. Is this true? Well, more study is needed but if I was the NBA player, I don't need to the whole study to prove it. All I need to know that it is a possibility that Jeremy Lin can be the next Brandon Roy if he comes back too soon from "lateral" meniscus tear.
So if I were Jeremy Lin's brother, I would tell him to ignore all the bravados of coming back early and win 1 game for the Knicks because we might celebrate his retirement next year ala Brandon Roy. Better safe than sorry. If he came back in Game 5, I hope he only played 5 min and the Knicks lost so he doesn't play in Game 6 or 7.
PS: Now I know Melo is on Jeremy's side because he told the media to expect Jeremy to come back next season so there is less pressure on him.
Jeremy Lin should not play. I don't agree that he would lose respect amongst his peers. He has already proven how dedicated he is to the game. Playing may seem to be proving manhood, but proving manhood may also involve stupid decisions. If manhood means brute mentality of playing through pain and creating hero stories, then many more reasoned decision makers would not be men.
And remember, if Jeremy Lin plays in Game 5 and Knicks actually pull off a win, he will also play the next game, with probably a expectation to shoulder more minutes.
I agree, Jeremy already proved his manhood to his teammates by always being there and doing all the drills and practices to try to come back early. That's what matters.
Finally, there is some serious lesson to learn from Brandon Roy who was a warrior but paid for it with early retirement.
For a dose of reality for the braves only, check out the pictures posted by a doctor of 4 degrees of meniscus tear in this post for Brandon Roy http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/11/15/1816820/brandon-roy-does-not-have-bone-on-bone-knee-arthritis
I know Brandon Roy already had chronic knee problems in college but if you looked at the total number of games in his 5 seasons, he actually played almost all 82 games in 07-09 before his injury in 09-10 season. Then he made the unwise decision of coming back 8 days after the surgery in in the playoff, won Game 4 against the Suns but lost the next 2 games and lost the series 4-2. And the minutes that he played in Game 4,5,6? It's 27, 19, and 37 minutes.
Brandon Roy's Career in 5 Seasons Year G PPG Notes 06-07 57 16.8 ROY. Missed some games due to some injury 07-08 74 19.1 Almost a full season 08-09 78 22.6 Almost a full season 09-10 65 21.5 Meniscus tear. Came back early in Round 1 and lost 2-4 to the Suns. 10-11 47 12.2 PPG dropped almost 50%. Looked normal in the early season until December.
It's important to note that Brandon Roy was announced out indefinitely in Dec 2010 but had warrior mentality to come back in February althought his PPG is only 8 and lost the 1st playoff series against Dallas 2-4.
What is the moral of the story? Brandon Roy chose to be a warrior and came back early. Everything looked normal until the middle of next season. The Portland doctors cleared him and he wanted to play. He paid for it.
So Jeremy can choose the warrior path and might help to win 1 game. Or even the series without getting injured.
But will his next season be cut short? Will he forced to retired in 3 or 5 seasons too early? Noone really knows but would you risk it? I'd say the Return of Investment is not worth it. 1 miraculous playoff series win vs 10-15 year of NBA career. I'd know what I choose.
I don't see Lin playing major minutes if he comes back.
In fact, I'm not sure if I even see him playing AT ALL.
I'd like to see Woodson put Lin in at MSG just so the fans can cheer him. On the other hand, Woodson would be fine if he refused to make Lin a human victory cigar like Brian Scalabrine (how the heck did he play 10+ NBA seasons despite having NO GAME???)
totally agree with 234 and ntt: to hell with Knicks. i want to see Jeremy thrive long term. Never be so shortsighted and risk long term career.
Jeremy, if you are reading this post (am sure you are!): listen to me, bro:
In this business and any business, YOU ARE YOUR ONLY SAVIOR. If you don't put your interests first, NO ONE will!
Don't be fooled by so called "pressure" created by these selfish blogger or media who want you to play. All the media cares is to make headlines so they can generate more revenues on their website; all the blogger (here and anywhere) who want you to play want is INSTANT GRATIFICATION!
Disgusting.... has anyone considered the best interest FOR YOU, Jeremy! Think carefully.
If you feel slightest pain or soreness in the knee, DON'T GO.
rest well and fully recover in the summer. Improve your outside shooting, going left and on-ball defense. No matter where you end up with (definitely should not be NY as you will turn into ordinary PG whose task is to just bring the ball up and shoot 3s), you will be fine.
When you are elected to HOF after 10 years, you will look back and say to yourself "I made a wise call in May 2012".
God blessed you and will always do as you have a good heart and soul.
In all likelihood, I bet Lin will make an announcement stating "I really wanted to play in game 5, but given the fact that I am not 100%, I felt that I would be a detriment rather than help to my teammates." I am almost 95% sure that he will make such statement before the game.
It's clear that Jeremy's injury was the more serious type of meniscus injury than was first disclosed. The Knicks and their cult of secrecy are paying for it now because people are calling his integrity and courage (!??) into question. His injury was serious, it's taking time to heal and he should not be pressured to play in a series that is pretty much a foregone conclusion. I honestly can't understand people who think he should take the risk. For WHAT????? This isn't Game 7 of the series for goodness sake. Suddenly now the Knicks' fate hinges on Lin? GTFOH. If we're fans, we should all be hoping he is given the time to recover and recover PROPERLY. If he's medically cleared, then that's different. BUt he hasn't and apparently his doctors are advising against it. FOR A REASON. t want to see Lin playing for years to come. Urging him to rush back for frankly superfluous reasons is just plain foolish.
Ok guys I am convinced that Jeremy should not to play since docc and himself have not come forward to declare he is ready Indeed only Jeremy knows his body and feel Let his parents famIly help him make decision
Most of you by now might have already read about the latest update on Jeremy's possibility to make a comeback this 1st round series is ZERO, as confirmed by Woodson.
Mike Woodson actually did a good job of coming out in defense for Jeremy saying he's not ready to play. Hopefully Stephen A Smith can shut his trap now.
Looking at the big picture of where Jeremy Lin should play to have 10-20 NBA careers, I would propose us (Jeremy Lin faithful fans) to encourage him to play for Phoenix Suns.
Why? Think about it this way.
"What is the single most important thing in Jeremy Lin's NBA career?" It should be his longevity because how else he would make an impact in the NBA and off-court ministry if he is not playing?
Even we will eventually stop blogging and making insightful comments in this blogsite.
There are two major reasons why Phoenix Suns (doctors) will be good for Jeremy. I also have a personal experience with Phoenix Suns orthopedic doctor that I will share with you.
1. Phoenix Suns have the best medical staff in the NBA
Grant Hill, Steve Nash, Michael Redd, Shaq. The evidence speaks for itself. They are 35-40 years old players who rejuvenated their career after coming to or staying with Phoenix Suns.
This is a must-read article to hear what these players said about "The Secret behind Phoenix Suns Elite Medical Staff" http://valleyofthesuns.com/2012/04/05/secret-behind-phoenix-suns-elite-training-staff/
... In 2009-10 and 2010-11 the Suns amazingly lost just 20 such games to injury, tops in the league by an incredibly large margin. The Suns also missed only 13 rotation games during the magical 2004-05 season, according to this chart. Basketball Prospectus’ Kevin Pelton measured health stats last year and found that only Oklahoma City lost less WARP than the Suns last year due to injury when Phoenix only missed out on 1.2 WARP despite an aging roster that featured Nash, Hill and the injury-prone vet Vince Carter. ...
2. Jeremy Lin's aggresive style of play is not conducive to long-term NBA career so he needs to adjust and also the best medical staff to look out for his interest
Most of us mentioned this already. He needs to pick and choose his spot. All the hard cut and stopping moves are quickly wearing off his meniscus and cartilage. I'm not saying stop changing how he plays but he needs to evolve, perhaps just do these amazing drive to the baskets in 4th quarters
The same article proved that the Suns’ medical staff is largely feted with praise thanks to their otherworldly efforts with the aging stars, but they have been just as good keeping the younger players healthy as well.
So while Jeremy can consult with them during the off-season like A-Rod from Yankees did, it does not replace the benefit of preventing injuries during the season.
As for my personal experience, I suffered a 3rd degree ACL tear from playing pick-up basketball 11 years ago but only decided to have ACL reconstructive orthopedic surgery 5 years ago with Dr. Thomas Carter who is the head team physician for Phoenix Suns. My knee used to buckle without any contact before the surgery and although I don't play competitive basketball against weekend warriors anymore, I can make cut left and right without any problems with my boys now. From my conversation with him about Steve Nash and other players, I learned that their team continuously monitored the players very well.
So fellow Jeremy fans, let's start petition to encourage Jeremy Lin to jump for joy if there is a possibility for him to play for Phoenix Suns.
Jeremy would have to forego the bright lights of New York and less marketing money but improve the possibility of playing for 10-18 years which optimize the most impact on-court and off-court for his ministries.
Disclosure: I live in Phoenix so there is a small chance I will benefit by watching Jeremy Lin play for Phoenix Suns :) But the numbers and what the aging players said don't lie, folks!
The only problem with Phx is that they overplay bad players while underpaying good players.
The result are these freaky teams with overworked and disgruntled stars who end up leaving and fat happy underachievers who the Suns can't get rid of. Lottery status is the inevitable result.
As much as I'd love Lin to play in Phx, I'd rather him to a team that will properly pay and play him.
KHuang, who do you think is more inept in Phx? The owner (Robert Sarver) or the GM (Lon Babby)?
Sarver kept selling draft picks like crazy and clearly was not willing to build championship team during Nash MVP years. For fans, he clearly just wants to be competitive enough to go to the first round of playoff and perhaps conference final so ticket sales will be brisk.
But what about Lon Babby as GM? Is he responsible for overpaying players?
And the whole thing about Steve Kerr abruptly left his GM position before was also fishy. Do you have any speculation?
Perhaps Phx is not willing to play for much but Alvin Gentry is a good coach. I would think the team is built around Nash and Jeremy can fill in his shoes to be the main playmaker, wouldn't you agree?
Even though I live in Phx, I don't follow the Suns closer than I follow other NBA teams. I know far more about the Indiana Pacers and San Antonio Spurs than I do about the Suns.
I haven't been the biggest Steve Kerr fan. Most of his moves have left me completely unimpressed. The only thing he did that really impressed me was trading for Shaq (I think Mike Dantoni pushed for that), and I LOVED the way Shaq played for the Suns before Steve Kerr traded him for less than nothing.
I was enraged when Kerr drafted superbust Robin Lopez ahead of Roy Hibbert (I went on youtube before he was drafted and predicted he'd become an All Star, which he indeed became). The Suns would have had a frontline of Shaq, Stat, and Hibbert. That would have made the Suns a perennial contender even if Shaq retired.
I hated Robin Lopez in college and would not even have drafted him in the 2nd round because he had a bad body AND couldn't play. Nope, he was drafted because he had the same HAIRCUT as Anderson Varejao who is a much more athletic and tough guy than the frail and uncoordinated Robin Lopez is. Kerr drafting him has set the franchise back and is a big reason why I don't follow the Suns. So even though I don't know why Kerr left, I am GLAD HE'S GONE.
I don't know what to make of Lon Babby. While Kerr inherited a good team, Babby inherited a mediocre one and has kept it mediocre. Guys like Shannon Brown, Josh Childress, and Sebastian Telfair shouldn't even be in the NBA. But Babby did make that EXCELLENT trade to get Marcin Gortat who I thought was overrated until Steve Nash started throwing him passes.
Sarver pays guys according to what he thinks their market value should be, not what it actually is. For example, Steve Nash has at least 2-3 good years left in him and is successfully battling off age. Thus I see Sarver lowballing Nash with something like a sub midlevel contract that will enrage Nash so much he walks.away. I would imagine that Jeremy Lin would be lowballed on contract negotiations, though his teammate Steve Novak is the type of limited role player Sarver likes to overpay.
On a purely basketball level, Jeremy Lin can start on any team in the NBA. I actually feel that Lin would help the Suns more than Nash would.
For Robin Lopez, I remember the Suns liked his defensive skills better than his brother Brook Lopez and Kerr thought they can coach his offensive potential but the development has been really slow. It could be a work ethic issue as Marcin Gortat's presence has not challenged him to get better soon.
I always like Gortat's game because like Jeremy, he was very productive during limited minutes in Orlando while backing up Dwight Howard. So a PG upgrade from Jameer Nelson to Steve Nash would only help him even more. Yes, this is a good trade because Gortat is CONSISTENTLY good.
I don't know enough about Shannon Brown, Telfair, Telfair because I stopped following the Suns closely when Sarver started selling draft picks like peanuts. Why care so much when the owner doesn't?
I don't know why more teams don't copy the Spurs draft philosophy because they always find personnels with good characters and will fit their team first mentality. Anytime I tune to the Spurs game, I always see everyone works so hard out there and they care. It's a testament to Popovich as the coach and Tim Duncan as the leader/elder. I would say the Spurs is more of a dynasty than the Lakers since they are consistently good for a longer time.
Jeremy can definitely play for any teams but as you know NBA is a cutthroat business so you need to find a coaching and medical team that look out for Jeremy's best interests to play for a long term in the NBA. I don't like D'Antoni's approach to riding Jeremy like a Secretariat. The jury is still out on Woodson because he only said Jeremy shouldn't play the Heat series after Carmelo had 1:1 conversation with Jeremy telling him not to jeopardize his future by coming back. So I like Carmelo being the "big brother" looking out for Jeremy's interests.
Perhaps another alternative is to send the NY Knicks medical team for a crash course with Phoenix Suns on injury preventive management, kinesiology, balancing muscle strength, etc. since we know Jeremy most likely would still be in NY in 1-2 years. What Carmelo wants, Carmelo gets. Woodson, Lin, etc.
Copying the Spurs won't work because there is only ONE Tim Duncan who can carry a team all by himself. That guy is the best I've ever seen at making minor leaguers look like major leaguers!
If the Suns really believed that Robin Lopez could defend at the NBA level, they are sorely mistaken. Lopez has already peaked, which is why he shrank when Gortat came in and took his job.
Jeremy Lin is a smart guy who will look out for hinself.
Jordan's real problem is that he won't pay big dollars to anybody who he doesn't feel would pose a threat to him during his playing days.
The problem with that is NOBODY is that good, not even Kobe. So Jordan throws his hands up and acts like there are no players.
It seems that Jordan is finally learning the lesson that totally eluded him as a player: that you have to believe in people and bring out the best in them instead of hurling them down a cliff and shouting "Get up".
That said, I've written before that Jordan should try to acquire Lin even if it means trading the #1 overall pick to get him.
I'd lock Jeremy Lin in Michael Jordan's private gym. Let them KILL each other. When Lin emerges, he'll be Jordan's little protege.
I've written that I've wanted Lin to train with Michael Ray Richardson (would be my TOP choice for Bobcats head coach), but Jordan is the ultimate teacher for Lin.
Jordan isn't very good at evaluating talent. That's why his Bobcats are so stint. Jordan is pretty bad as an owner and even worse as a GM. But, KHuang's comments make Jordan looks like the smartest person on the world. Do you think Jeremy Lin is worth a No. 1 overall pick? Im a huge Jeremy Lin fan, but it enrages me when people make stupid comparison that doesn't make sense. I could sense the level of KHuang's basketball knowledge when he's constantly claiming that Tim Duncan is the greatest basketball player of all time. Go figure...
Actually, I was being realistic. People like you comparing JLin to Michael Jordan (the greatest player in the history of the game, NOT DUNCAN) and making stupid claims make Jlin loses credibility and his fans base looks bad.
The NBA is no different from any other American corporation, salivating over how much money they can exploit from the billions and billions of consumers in China and Asia.
-Like people have been saying, he needs to pick his spots to attack the rim. Not only to reduce TOs but to reduce stress on his knee.
-Keep working on half-court playmaking. Hesitation dribbles. Bounce passes in traffic. Recognizing traps (and doing great counter-moves like the rematch in Philly).
-Stop doing that hard stop-and-pivot for a fadeaway jumper. It's an effective move, but it's murder on the knee. Not worth it.
-Team chemistry. Jeremy didn't really play that much with Melo AND Amare AND Tyson at the same time. And Fields had no jumper for most of the season.
The Knicks & Jeremy could be SCARY with a healthy roster and a full summer, training camp and preseason to prepare.
I wonder if his surgery wasn't as successful as he had expected. The problem of soreness after practice is worrisome. I really hope he can heal completely and be stronger and better than he ever was as promised.
If Jeremy Lin were just a normal guy playing pickup ball, he'd be cleared to play based on his rapid recovery. However this is the NBA and that's far more strenuous than pickup ball.
I'd imagine that it'll take about 1 more month for Lin to feel 100%.
how do you know that his surgery was very successful? I am very worried about jeremy's knees. Two knee surgeries in two years. You just dont see that very often. And plus he barely played at all last year with golden state. This year he only really played in 20 gaems. This shows that his body probably isn't able to handle a NBA season and his style of play. I am very worried about his long term career.
You are 100% correct about Jeremy Lin currently being unable to handle a full NBA season.
Jeremy Lin went from playing almost no minutes to playing major minutes against teams that played him extremely physically. Though Lin was successful in firmly establishing himself as a NBA player, the price he paid was knee surgery.
Now that Lin will be entering a full offseason to strengthen his body and prepare for the NBA grind, Lin be more than ready for next season. He'll get proper coaching, have a designated rotation role, and will have worked on the weaknesses in his game.
Remember that Lin bounced around the league and didn't even know if he'd stick in the NBA a few months ago. He went from sleeping on his brother's couch to being triple teamed by the Heat in like two weeks. Next season, Lin won't go from being the forgotten man to the designated target of triple teams.
Lin will adjust his game and play well in the NBA for a long time.
This was obvious. They have no shot in winning the series. On top of that, Jeremy is making the minimum salary this season. He would be a fool o play in this game. There must have been pressure from his camp to sit it out and wait til he gets his contract first and that's the right move to do. This is a business, and everyone in the nba is out for themselves. The moral of te story: just do your job, get paid, and go home. These people are not playing for pleasure. This is a job and the players have family and personal lives to attend outside of the game.
I'm happy for Jeremy because he's getting paid more and will have a fresh start next season. My guess is he won't be back in NY next season because of lack of chemistry among the players, but he will be playing for a team that really needs him and that's all he really cares about. Leave the fake media drama out and you will see what's really going on..
In the beginning of the season, we were happy if Jeremy even got just 20 minutes a game. He has exceeded expectations greatly. We should be great full the reporters are even bringing him up, because he easily could have fallen through the cracks this season either being waived, sent permanently to the dleague, or still played the 12th man role and being inactive for the playoffs.
From a business standpoint, the Knicks might be better off not playing Lin even if he wants to. Playing him would let everyone know if the knee is sound. That is just showcasing him to other teams who might make him an offer. If other teams can't be sure, they might not do so. This would actually allow the Knicks to make a lower bid to Lin.
Perhaps a good scenario would be that the Knicks sign Steve Nash with the Mid Level Exemption and offer Lin a lower, back-loaded contract. I would like to see Lin learn from Nash, then blossom into a superstar, kind of like an Aaron Rogers/ Bret Favre kind of thing.
I'm much more intrigued by JL's continued non-committal statement about his future. Also, he praises "New York" not just MSG. Brooklyn, ahem...
So if D-Will bolts the Nets (which he probably will), and Brooklyn offers Lin that 4-year backloaded contract...I think Jeremy would probably sign that offer sheet. That would force the Knicks to match and they might not if they can get Nash instead.
While I don't agree with the article, there is the fact that Jeremy is not a NBA veteran whose years of conditioning and will overcome a physical injury.
As far as the haters go, those are the same people who'd be clamoring for Lin NOT to be playing if he were healthy. So since they aren't going to be happy no matter what, worrying about their opinions is pointless.
I hope we re not talking about this again for game six. I enjoyed reading all the comments but it got quite heated with some bloggers. Who knew a meniscus would draw such attention.
Wow, Melo took the same number of shots as James and Bosh combined. Stat had 7 shots? Didn't watch the game since JLin wasn't playing anyway. But if that is a healthy Stat, 7 shots is just crazy. It seemed JR was firing away all right.
I don't know if everyone had a chance to read this article: http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7913991/nba-playoffs-2012-jeremy-lin-new-york-knicks-most-important-player-2013 . It's a great article, and the two key points I extrapolated from this article were:
(1) As I stated in a previous post, the Knicks were going nowhere with Melo iso-ball and Tyson Chandler pretty much quoted that same sentiment. I also laughed when the Knicks matched up with Miami because I know they were going to get crushed. I was happy this happened because I knew that this would teach Melo a lesson about what it takes to win- a team.
(2) Jeremy needs to learn to play the politics better- perception is everything. He shouldn't have said that "he was at 85 percent". He shouldn't have quantified the percentage and left the whole situation unclear. The only thing that should have been clear was that this could be seriously impacting his future career, and the doctors told him not to play at all. As a Lin fan and after watching him this past year, I know what he's about and what he is willing to do to win. Unfortunately, not all people see it the same way and all of the haters are coming out to roost. It's a good lesson for him on how to deal with these situations moving forward.
I think JLin is more than a little bit naive about how the world really works and the (not so) benevolent intentions of the media, the NBA, and the fans, whom he is always praising.
These same people who claim to cheer you on or build you up will be the same people that throw you under the bus when it serves their interests.
Pros :
ReplyDelete-help the team, no matter how minimally. Can't do worse than a beaten-up BD or the other two guards;
-gain some valuable playoff experience, against one of the top teams no less;
-who knows, might just shake off the rust and spark a win.
Cons:
-high risk of re-injury because the Heat will want to take him out of the equation straightaway, so they can return to defending Melo and Stat. They'll play hard and dirty, as playoff games tend to be. Might even be career-threatening;
-risk of injuring some other part of the body;
-rusty play resulting in sky-high TOs and ineffective defense/offense puts a dent on his reputation;
-he himself expressed some concern about disrupting the team chemistry (it's really about disrupting Melo's iso game since that's what it's boiled down to).
Overall, I think it's just not worth it. Come back stronger next season. In any case, Melo sounded like he really didn't want JLin back now when he said he looked forward to having JLin back on the team next season (i.e. not now). I won't be surprised if, as usual, he wants all the spotlight and be the hero, especially at this critical point. I say let him have it, let him earn his keep. And when the Knicks inevitably fall to the Heat (I don't like them but have to admit that they are really in another class of their own, having had a full season to gel and not having any injuries), no blame can be attached to JLin. But his not playing will only further cool Woodson's already cold attitude towards him, it's as if Woodson thinks he's malingering or something.
But somehow, I think the competitor in JLin will make him decide to come back. There'll certainly be a lot of pressure over the next few days.
Davis isn't just beaten up; he's out. That's the key difference in the public's perception of whether Lin should man up and suit up for Game 5. If Davis was available for Game 5, the spotlight wouldn't be on Lin to return. The risk of Lin disrupting the team's chemistry with Davis at PG is no longer a consideration; the large gap left by Lin, Davis, and Shumpert in the rotation is the greater concern.
DeleteBy Wed, Lin will be less than 1 week from his projected return date, the Knicks have added hope with the Game 4 win, and their guard situation is critical. Those factors don't raise the expectation that Lin should play well, heavy minutes, or make the Knicks the favorites, but they do raise the expectation that a genuine team leader would take the initiative to make himself available for the sake of the team.
Under the circumstances, the greater danger to Lin's long-term reputation isn't playing badly. The greater danger is the perception Lin cared more about himself than the team, and he held back in an all-hands-on-deck situation when he could have tried to play, when his team needed him to act like the leader he's supposed to be.
All this "man up" garbage is just that, garbage. They still have Douglas and Bibby, if anyone should "man up" it should be those two, not someone who's injured, that's ridiculous.
DeleteThis is not some life and death situation, enemy troops aren't rushing the base and everyone must fight injured or not or risk death. This is basketball.
JLin's name was enough to raise MSG's stocks by 32% this year, because their revenue killed estimates due to him. Regardless if he comes back or not they are not getting rid of him.
You know I just had a dinner and some drinks with a bunch of long time diehard Knicks fans...In Phillie of all places. ALL THEY TALK ABOUT IS JLIN, and how proud they were when they all showed up at the Sixers game wearing Knicks jersey. Melo isn't even in the conversation, except when they talk about what a douchbag move it was on his part to oust D'Antoni. Real fans sees this: Melo will never replace JLin as long as JLin wears a Knicks jersey. We all know he can score, but he's not the star he thinks he is...He's trying to pass himself off as Kobe/LBJ quality, not even close.
Team leader? Haven't Woodson made it clear enough that Melo and STAT are the team leads? Do you need a rock star PG to continue feeding the ball to Melo's iso game? What would that actually accomplish? Role players like Novak still ain't going to get the ball, its all about Melo then STAT. JLin returning now at this time isn't going to change this.
So why have him come back now when he can be stronger next season, and not risk injury, especially with Knicks pathetic medical staff? IMO I agree he should go to Suns if Knicks won't keep him, fat chance that'll happen though.
JLin should play in Game 5 because this is the NBA not the WNBA, remember???
ReplyDeleteWe shouldn't using a one-dimensional approach to assess the possibility of Jeremy playing in game 5. It isn't just about gender = women being weaker and men being men should be macho and insist on fighting a losing battle. We are talking about the pros and cons if Jeremy takes the court without being 100% healthy, spoiling the chemistry of the team, etc, etc.
DeleteR_U_Sure, there's no reason to interject sexist remarks like that to make a point. You should know better, especially in a forum where we constantly discuss how Jeremy was marginalized, belittled and ignored because of his ethnicity.
DeleteI'm not interjecting anything but saying the NBA is on a whole nother level than the WNBA.. Why did you guys assumed that I said anything bad about women??? My mother is a woman, relax...
DeleteThe NBA isn't co-ed and Lin's teammates are all men. In general and for fans, platonic values of manhood characterize men's sports, or any male-dominated competitive arena for that matter (such as the military, which shares values with sport). For Lin, those platonic values of manhood inform the relationships within his particular competitive tribe of men.
DeleteTeams that don't hew to platonic male values are likely not the good teams.
R_U_Sure's point is valid.
It's quite clear to everyone what you meant, R_U_Sure, so don't try to act so smug and indignant when someone calls you out on it. You and your buddy Eric are of the opinion (whether consciously or subconsciously) that women can't be as competitive as men and can't form the kind of comradery necessary to excel at a team sport like basketball. You believe this even though the WNBA as a whole averages more assists per 100 possessions than the NBA (5.25 vs 4.55). So it doesn't matter how much work and sweat these women put in, it doesn't matter how much they dominate their respective opponents, in your world view it will never be enough to prove to you that they are competitors in their own right. Does this sound familiar to you?
DeleteWhat R_U_Sure meant, as I understood it, is that the NBA is a league of men, paternalistic, tribal, and competitive by design, and Jeremy Lin will be judged for his decision as a man by the men of his tribe (his team) and the league. The NBA, indeed, is not the women's NBA. It's the men's NBA where Lin will be judged as a man by men.
DeleteThose of us who have been part of similar communities understand the implications for his reputation of Lin's decision.
C'mon guys and girls.
DeleteThe WNBA is a great league where the women are just as tough and professional as their male counterparts.
Any WNBA professional faced with the same situation as Lin would do what he's doing: try to tough her way back into playoff games.
I stand with Aids Bike on this one. Jeremy Lin faced discrimination for being Asian. I certainly won't discriminate against female WNBA players either.
I have not attended a Suns or Mercury game here in Phx yet. But there's a high likelihood that I go see the Mercury before I see the Suns!
@Aids Bike, Calm your ass down, you're comparing WNBA assist to the NBA?? I can compare any statistics NBA>WNBA and get a far greater number, heck it shouldn't even be in the same discussion.. Why are you so offended??? You're on the internet and you seemed so butt hurt over a comment I made about NBA being better than the WNBA, lol.. It was you who insinuated that women are weak and can't compete with men.. You are the one who had to go farther than what my comment was intended for..
DeleteThe NBA may play better basketball than the WNBA, but that does not mean the players sacrifice themselves any less.
DeletePro sports are pro sports. Jeremy Lin will do his best to play, jusy like the pros of the WNBA do night after night. Most of the WNBA players even play year round, as the players play in overseas leagues and then come to the WNBA for the offseason.
I do not see the WNBA as any less of a league than the NBA, though obviously the women cannot compete against the men. When I watch WNBA games, I see the same toughness and professionalism that the NBA demonstrates.
it already 3-1 down. what's the odds?
ReplyDeleteBetter than they were at 3-0.
Delete0%. absolutely no reason for lin to play.
DeleteIf Lin can play, he should play.
ReplyDeleteThat said, Woodson should heavily curtail his minutes and bench Lin the instant he falters.
The playoffs are a critical learning experience for Lin. Even playing the grand total of 2 minutes in Game 5 would be enough to give Lin a taste of playoff basketball.
Yes! I want him to experience this playoff. Even for just 2 minutes, pls. I'm so desperate to see him playing again. I feel like I'm wasting money for NBA League Pass ( if I don't see him playing before the end of this season). I prayed that they win on game 4 because I want to see him in game 5. But God is the only one who knows what is good for Jeremy, I'm still praying everyday for his speedy recovery and I'm praying that he will comeback stronger and lead the knicks again next season. I'm forever Jeremy's fan and I will follow him wherever he go, for better or worse I will support him until he retire.
Deletewhat's sad is that Toney Douglass is so bad that Jeremy returning from a surgery is being talked about more than Toney playing.
ReplyDeleteESPN are now openly questioning whether Lin is holding back for his contract. Driven of course by the sanctimonious and biased Stephen A Smith and his loyal sidekick Skip B. It's causing a bit of a stir on twitter. Good Lord. A few weeks ago, people were all "Jeremy who?" and now it's "Lin must play of else?" It's crazy the amount of craziness Jeremy inspires.
ReplyDeleteAh, it's a COMPLIMENT.
DeleteThose guys aren't like "Will Toney Douglas play???"
BSPN is the TMZ or Jerry Springer of sports.
DeleteThey peddle tabloid sensationalism and stir up manufactured controversy to promote their increasingly idiotic "brand identity" and the BSPN sports empire.
ESPN is the World Wide Leader in .... bullsh#t.
no one kicks a dead dog. now he's far from it.
DeleteStephen A Smith is a tool...First he's like "Melo is gawd Lin sucks he should be traded" now he's like "Lin is holding back for contract" like Lin is all the sudden important in his eyes? LOL...
DeleteI'm glad Woodson and Carmelo don't put pressure publicly for Jeremy to play or be the hero in Game 5.
ReplyDeletehttp://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7900540/2012-nba-playoffs-new-york-knicks-not-expecting-jeremy-lin-back-game-5
"We'll gauge it today and tomorrow, but I'm not counting on Jeremy Lin to play," Woodson said on a conference call Monday.
I think the Knicks will start Bibby and has Toney Douglass come off the bench. They will only put Jeremy in the 2nd or 3rd quarter if the game is getting out of hand and see if he can energize them with pick-and-roll and putting the ball in Melo, Amare, and Novak's hands. I think the strategy is smart to not expect much but treat him like a "secret weapon".
It looks like Amare and Jeremy have been practicing a lot of pick-and-roll as part of Amare's recovery process from this article:
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/18912/spo-on-stat-he-gave-them-a-little-punch
Here's how Stoudemire described the recovery process after the game:
"The last few days I've just been practicing on it, seeing how it feels, trying certain braces for me to see how they felt in practice. Two days ago, I had a brace that felt OK. I was able to give it a little go. I was able to get up and down with Jeremy [Lin] and Toney Douglas to work on my pick-and-rolls and my catches and finishes. On Saturday, I was able to give it a go again and it was feeling better and better. So today, I felt even better. That's when I knew I was ready to play."
With Davis out, Jeremy will definitely play for 5-20 minutes. Who knows? Let's hope and pray that Jeremy's knees hold.
Let the legend of Lin begin!
did you mean, Let the legend of Lin CONTINUE?
Deleteyes, of course! Part Deux of Linning Time, here we come...
DeleteThere's also something in the front of my mind that I want Lin to learn from playing this game.
ReplyDeleteFor Lin to have a long successful NBA career, he needs to learn how to pick his spots.
I firmly believe that if Jeremy Lin is minimally healthy, he can play Game 5 and be very effective in a very conservative role. I want him to learn that he does not have to constantly overwhelm opponents with his athleticism in order to play well in the NBA.
True. If Lin is as versatile and smart a guard as we think he is, he should be able to contibute in different ways even if he's too rusty and out of shape to do all the things we're used to seeing from him.
DeleteYes, perhaps Nash's style would be a good one to emulate? After all, he's still playing well when he's 38 years old.
DeleteJeremy's style to attack the basket reminds me of DWade's style a few years ago but even DWade has adjusted since then. Otherwise, it must be really hard on the knees.
If Lin can look like old Jason Kidd in Game 5, that would be a success.
DeleteMaybe Lin will even do the "Isiah Thomas" and explode for 25 points in a single playoff quarter despite playing only on one leg?
DeleteI saw that game. It was like watching the final scene of "Better Off Dead" when John Cusack's character Lane Myers wins a ski race despite having only one ski!
I feel that if Jeremy does not play his image may get tarnished and some people may pour dirty wAter on him and calling him selfish only considering his health and career
ReplyDeleteRemember Woodson commented that some athletes played with the same injury jeremy had and people see how David and stat played with injuries, if knicks lose and Jeremy does not play, Knicks fans probably turn their angry towards Lin.
On the other hand, Jeremy Lin may turn on the heat again, the heat will want to send the message again: told you, we have seen Lin before, there will be no difference this time
Now thinking from this angle, I think Jeremy should play but be very cautious
Because the heat really does not like Jeremy get anything
Just hope the heat do not do dirty play like the Jason Kidd
and god is protecting jeremy
People who would criticize Lin for not playing are the same ones that criticize Lin for playing!
DeleteJeremy Lin can protect Jeremy Lin by picking his spots to attack. It doesn't matter whether he's healthy or not, he has to slow his pace and play efficiently.
I am glad Jeremy Lin used his body as a battering ram to knock down NBA defenses in order to establish himself in the league. Michael Jordan did the same thing in his 2nd year and ended up missing most of the season.
Lin no longer needs to be a battering ram. He just needs to let the game come to him and adjust his pace downwards.
Play or not to play?
ReplyDeleteNow i am voting to play.
But with min minutes and with extreme caution
People expect him being rusty
People won't be surprised if knicks loses
The only con for playing is the risk to get re-injured
Maybe play with less aggressiveness?
HE should PLAY. Don't care if he's rusty, the team NEEDS him after what happened to Baron Davis. HE NEEDS TO PLAY. If the doctor said that he can play, he should play. Really i'm a JLin fan since day 1 (before Linsanity) and I'll be really disappointed if he chose not to play. His team needs him more than ever right now. On top of that, its already been 5 weeks since the surgery. Most players return even sooner than that. He's been practicing for over a week and the game still isnt' until WED so he should have enough to prepare physically. I hope JLin isn't sitting out to protect his brand and to get a bigger contract. Also please make sure the doctor clears him first.
ReplyDeleteTotally agree.
DeleteBesides, Lin isn't going to play many minutes anyway.
I'm actually more worried about Lin playing WELL than playing poorly. If he plays too well, he might throw a Jordan style hissy fit if Woodson benches him!
Lin is a Knick, and the Knicks are the franchise whose proudest moment is Willis Reed limping onto the court in Game 7 of the 1970 finals. There's a reason Reed's old Knicks teammates still reverently call him "The Captain". With Davis's injury, 5+ weeks since the surgery, a week of teasing fans about a possible return, and an elimination game, Lin's reputation will be judged far less on the Knicks winning or his playing high-level basketball (both unlikely) than what Lin shows the world as a competitor, leader, and role model - especially as a role model for Asian-American boys who ask, What Would Jeremy Do? Lin will be forgiven for faltering on the court, but he won't be viewed kindly for turning his back on his team under these circumstances.
DeleteWoodson's latest comments are clear: it's Lin's choice. If the doctors sign off and Lin says he wants to play, then Lin will play. However, barring re-injury to his knee in practice, if Lin wants to play Game 5, the team doctors won't be able to stop him.
If the young Lin aspires to be a respected virtuous leader among the men of the NBA, the right decision for him is to play in Game 5.
Listen to woodson's praise on David and bibbly
DeleteAnd the way Woodson push the ball to Jeremy's hand
If the doc gives the green light, Jeremy should tell the coach he will play
And let the coach decide if he is good enough skill wise to play
It would hurt Jeremy really really bad if after a loss and some inside info leaked out
Suggesting doc ok'ed but Jeremy held back
Another story of course if the doc says otherwise
With Landry field and Novak said Jeremy looks good, it's hard for Jeremy to convince people he is still to sore to play
It is very tricky, hope god gives Jeremy the wisdom to make the right decison
I don't agree at all that Jeremy Lin would be seen as turning his back on the team if he refused to play.
DeleteUnlike Lamar Odom who was perfectly healthy but was too swept up by his reality show to focus on his basketball duties, Lin is legitimately injured. He doesn't even have medical clearance yet.
Al Horford of the Hawks has been out far longer than Lin. He's thinking about playing, but nobody is pressuring him. If he chooses not to play, nobody will criticize him. And they won't criticizeLin either.
Asian American boys like me don't ask "What would Jeremy do?" We ask "How much does he make" or "How good can he be?"
Woodson said Jeremy is not in great shape for playoff basketball.
ReplyDeletehttp://offthedribble.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/05/07/knicks-lin-has-hurdles-to-clear-before-a-return/?src=tp
“I’ve watched him shoot and run up and down – he’s not in great shape,” Woodson said. “You know as well as I know that playoff basketball you’ve got to be at an all-time high and he hasn’t played in a while.”
I changed my vote to want to see him play but I won't think any less of him if he decides he can't play. He knows his body the most and realizes debilitating injury can happen any time. Baron Davis is the latest example. Also, I read somewhere meniscus tear is tricky because it can lead to microfacture surgery in the long-term.
Let's support him 100% no matter what happens in Game 5! And pray hard for his long-term health. I'd take 15-20 years of NBA career anytime over a remote possibility of a miraculous win in 1 playoff series. Wait, maybe I'll change my vote again...Man, I don't know what to think now.
Some analyst on espn says there is a 95% chance that Lin will play in game 5 because the Knicks are really pressing Lin hard to come back. I wonder how accurate that is? I really want to see him play but he will not be fully healed and rusty. I don't want the last game Lin plays this season to be a bad one.
ReplyDeleteThe only bad outcome for Lin would be if he chooses against joining them in the foxhole.
DeleteNonsense.
DeleteIf Lin is not healthy enough to play, no real pro is going to hold that against him.
To hell with New York.
ReplyDeleteLin should come back and risk injury to his knee and jeopardize his career for what?
So New York can increase its chances of a win from 2% to 3%?
So he can appease New York fans who will throw him under the bus if he falters or struggles against the Heat?
Contrary to what delusional New York fans think, the Knicks ain't beating the Heat in this series.
The NBA is a business first, middle, and last.
If you don't look out for your own self-interest, nobody else will. Lin should keep that in mind
totally agree. he gotta learn to watch out for himself.
Deleteif he does, i think melo wld make sure knicks loses just to make him look bad.
let melo carry the team and earn him keep.
Check out Jeremy's glasses in this article
ReplyDelete"Jeremy Lin Shouldn't Play Unless He Can Play"
http://nymag.com/daily/sports/2012/05/jeremy-lin-shouldnt-play-unless-he-can-play.html
Doesn't that look like Clark Kent's glasses? A Willis Reed moment would be Game 6 in NY. Jeremy should sit on the bench with his suit and glasses then go inside a phone booth and come out with his Knicks jersey ala Superman! The Garden would really be rocking :)
Has anybody checkrd out the anatomy of the meniscus and what it looks like? Very tiny little things that act as shock absorbers for your kneecap. Very fragile part. Its a wonder they stay in at all in your knee. Im no expert, but looking at images of them, they look like they can slip and slide and blowout at anytime. Now the weight you put on it on the court and in the playoffs is magnified exponentially. Isnt it true that in life, the little things you take for granted becomes a constant chronic problem if only we take the time to heal. While the bigger issues gets resolved because we make sure that it is done right the first time. I think in this case you need a fiduciary component that s gonna look out for the best interest of Lin. It is not the team, the coach the doctors or even Lin himself. It is his parents. Whatever they say goes. Hey that is so Asian but it works. Hows that for a different point of view?
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone actually believe these Knicks even with Jeremy are going to be the only team in history to come back from 0-3 against this healthy Heat team? Seriously???
ReplyDeleteHasn't anybody been watching what happened to Rose, Shump, and now Davis? Non contact injuries people. Jeremy could easily go down again and ruin his free agency run.
What free-agency run??? JLin isn't going nowhere. The Knicks have his rights this offseason to match what any other team can give him, which is $5.5 Million. That's the max. any team can give him.
DeleteTeams could EASILY pry Lin off the Knicks if they offered him a backloaded multiyear contract.
DeleteJeremy has to go for broke. It's no longer a matter whether he can help the Knicks win. It's about showing leadership and courage. Look at Stat playing with half his hand cut off, BD playing with a bulging disk and fighting to the end when he can no longer, same with Shump playing his hardest until he can't. Prior to his teammate's injuries it made sense he does not play. But it's different now. He has to be a fearless warrior and fight for his fallen team mates.
ReplyDeleteTheres a whole in your argument. Amare hurt himself foolishly, he has to come back for redemption..BD has been hurt all his career, nothing new. Shump is a rookie, no comment. Lin has already shown his fearlessness but postponing the surgery in order to prove his value during and prior to Linsanity.
DeleteHole not whole. My phone cant spell. ;)
Deleteleadership and courage was when he led them back to .500 instead of being down with a record of 7 wins and 23 losses.
Deleteit is ludicrous for uneducated fools like you to call out lin and state he has no leadership or courage when he hasn't even been cleared for 5on5 play. FOH.
Dude, you need to grow a spine. You sound like a wimp.
Delete"grow a spine"? how about you grow a brain? citing shumpert's injury is disingenuous, as he went down with a freak injury. citing baron is disingenuous as well, as he was shut down for almost a year while the knicks were tanking themselves out of the playoffs until lin saved them. and LOL at your amare self inflicted wound argument. FOH.
Deletewhen a pussy like you learns what cutting and jumping actually means in basketball, let us know.
one more fact to put you in your place: chris paul missed at least 6-7 weeks when he went down with knee surgery, and looked like trash when he returned. are you trying to say chris paul is a wimp and lacks leadership and courage? there goes your idiotic argument. FOH.
DeleteI must have hit a nerve with leadership and courage, two characteristics you probably lack which explains why you react the way you do on this board. You attack others by citing how stupid they are. You just showed your true colors. You need to see a counselor for anger management. I have responsibilities and a job, so don't expect a reply.
Deleteyeah... fearless.
Deletewhy don't you jump down a 10 storey building. I'll respect you for fearless.
LOL! yeah, notice bloggereng completely ducking the chris paul example because he can't overcome the stupidity of his own argument. posters like you deserve a verbal smackdown for idiocy. what happened? you can't call out chris paul for his lack of courage and leadership because it exposes your hypocrisy? take your idiotic "courage" argument and shove it.
Deletealso, you didn't hit a nerve, you just made it fun for me to check this website again during my work shift. now you're crying about me needing a counselor for anger anger management? don't confuse anger with pure joy of "making you my punching bag" (stole that from khuang haha). i guess we should have you institutionalized for sheer stupidity. try again, kid. continue ducking.
I'm glad you liked my quote, ntt. BAM!
DeleteHowever, I agree with BOTH sides here.
Jeremy Lin should go for broke if he's cleared to play. This is the NBA where guys that shouldn't be playing better not enter the game and hurt themselves and.their teams.
Jeremy Lin should also be very careful about coming back too soon. There are long term consequences to think about. Guys on losing teams routinely get shut down so that they don't jeopardize their health playing in games that will not lead to the playoffs. Kevin Love was shut down this year for that reason.
So stop your bickering, guys. You are ALL right. Use ME as your punching bag if you can't accept that.
Lin should just take the rest of the season off. There's no point in trying to come back now. He's never been in the playoffs, its much tougher physically/mentally, especially coming back from an injury. I certainly don't want to see him come back just to go back down in round 2.
DeleteIf he's at 50% he might as well let Bibby/Douglas pull their weight. And no, he ALREADY showed enough leadership, its what got him injured in the first place, Jeremy has nothing to prove.
Besides, Knicks medical staff well, sucks. Honestly I'd rather see him go to Suns, especially the way he plays.
If Jeremy is to stay with Knicks and the doc says ok to play I think he should play
ReplyDeleteOtherwise he will be marginalized
If there is any conflict rising in the future his teammates would simply smack his dignity by one sentence:
Where were you during the playoff against Miami heat?
No, that is not how the NBA works.
DeleteLin isn't just injured. He's out of shape, hasn't played in a long time, and has not been part of the team.
Everybody on the team sees Lin striving with all his might to come back. That is why nobody is calling him out the way the Mavs did with Lamar Odom who simply refused to play.
NBA player don't earn trust solely by what they do on the court. They prove themselves to each other off the court as well.
huh? dignity? how about , "you wouldn't even be in the playoffs if it wasn't for my winning streak."
Deletesorry, but some of you fans are morons.
No way, Lin shouldn't be pressured into playing by rabid fans like us! Unless he can play aggressively like his usual self, what's the point of playing?
ReplyDeleteThis is not pressure. This is the reality. Jeremy has to think through all the consequences. Of course, if the doctor says he can't play, it's another story.
ReplyDeleteIt all boils down the assessment from the doctor I guess.
Even you cannot count on the doctors. Its all subjevtive as far as healing time. Some heal faster or slower. Only Lin knows, but he will have people pressure him. To be really fearless, you have to stick to your guns and not let anybody bully you to come back before yore ready.
Delete"reality" is the knicks have 0% chance of taking the series. 0. zero. z-e-r-o.
Deletewhy should lin risk anything at this point? this is the reality, "linfanonly".
Why should Lin risk anything?
DeleteBecause we are LIN JUNKIES who'll do anything to get a high from watching Lin (not) play.
The Knicks probably won't even win Game 5. But I would love to see Knick fans cheering Lin in Game 6 even if the Knicks lose by 40.
It could be the last time Jeremy Lin plays in a Knicks uniform.
as good a poster as you have been, Khuang, you just proved every human being has its dark side: that is have pleasure built on other's pain.
Deleteyou are talking about playing in a game that with very high probability of getting injured again or worse, which could put Jeremy out for good 8-12 months like Iman/Rose.
it also reveals a simple truth of American: instant gratification.
i can only shake my head...
if doctors clear him and he feel good, then do it.
but if there is any risk, don't. period.
who cares about this stupid Knicks team? It is just reported that Woodson has had talk with Front office on returning as head coach. He WILL get it for sure, needless to say his buddy GM will love to keep him. Dolan is a clueless POS owner.
I would not want to see Jeremy in Knicks' uniform next year. this team is not suitable for Jeremy. He can learn same defensive skills and grow with other teams.
Hey, I don't want Lin to play if he can't either!
DeleteI'm glad he's shut down. Really!
I think JLin can play about 6 minutes per half, and play safe. Shoot the open 3s like Bibby, and no need to attack the rim. It will be like rehab for him.
ReplyDeleteif that's all lin will do, you might as well throw bibby and douglass in there instead of lin.
DeleteJLin has been doing a lot of shooting these days. He may be able to get hot and make a difference in the game. Both Bibby and Douglas have been shooting poorly all season long. He can play this game like a scrimmage. No need to go all out.
DeleteDidn't Brandon Roy have the same injury as Lin, try to come back early to help a team in the playoffs that had no real chance of advancing in 2008.
DeleteNow, Roy is retired and out of the league before the age of 30 thanks to a series of degenerative knee injuries.
Just something to keep in mind with respect to Lin.
Actually, Brandon Roy had bad knees the instant he came into the NBA. Those knees were so bad that teams passed over him and Minnesota traded him away. Plus he played for Portland which has always been a franchise struck with career ending leg injuries. So his injury history was far worse than Lin's.
DeleteThe saving grace is that Mike Woodson won't be tempted to leave Lin in the game too long. In fact, Woodson might not even play Lin at all even if Lin is medically cleared.
If there is a Game 6 and Lin plays, I'd be happy to see him for about 4 minutes total - one minute per quarter!
Agree with KHuang. Unlike Roy, I think Lin's injury is not as severe.
DeleteHe should be able to provide 8-12 quality minutes. He for sure will not be in superb game shape but I'll even settle to see him in uniform.
Also Roy came back like 2 days after the same surgury in a much more severe tear than JLin. It has been 5 and half weeks for JLIN
DeleteHey unknown, Brandon Roy is trying to make a comeback.
DeleteLet him do it right here in Phoenix, where I am a reluctant homer. I have traditionally HATED watching the Suns because they play outside-in basketball, but I'm all for them getting players like Jeremy Lin and Grant Hill and Michael Redd.
Both Brandon Roy and Greg Oden should join Phoenix. The Suns have the legendary Aaron Nelson for trainer who's so good that he broke Channing Frye out of a shooting slumping by literally fixing his ASS.
How about this? Since the Suns have no desire to resign Steve Nash, how about the Knicks use the entire midlevel exception on Nash and let Lin go to the Suns. Acquire Brandon Roy and Greg Oden at minimum contracts and bring over Steve "I can't survive without Lin" Novak and Lamar "Sun Killer" Odom. Plug Lin into the starting lineup with Redd/Roy, Hill/Odom, Marcin Gortat at PF, and Oden at center. Let Aaron Nelson keep Lin injury free. See what happens.
Wow. Thank God your not the Knicks GM.
DeleteYeah, I'm also glad I'm not the Knicks GM!
DeleteAmare was "doubtful" for Game 4...then a "game-time decision"...then ended up starting, playing heavy minutes and doing pretty darn well.
ReplyDeleteSo until they officially rule out Jeremy for Game 5, I'm assuming he'll at least suit up and be ready for limited action (10-15mpg).
i think the most appropriate outcome that if his doctors clears him to play, is to play a less aggressive, traditional role of PG, not the Steve Nash style of play, that will not over strain his repaired knee, and at the same time, still allow Melo to take on the superstar role.
ReplyDeleteLet's face it, knicks need a decent PG, that's the minimum that you need for now. Don't forget about Stats, Melo & steve Novak, etc.
Folks, it's never wise to make uninformed decision and in our case, an uninformed opinion.
ReplyDeleteI was caught in the exuberance of watching "Jeremy Lin Playoff Moment" so I thought 4-5 minutes won't do any harm. I did a bit more research trying to put myself in his shoes or his parents. I changed my mind.
We only know about what the media reported about Jeremy Lin's injury and "politically correct" coaches and teammates who are not doctors and qualified to clear Jeremy to play intense playoff basketball. "He looks good to play in practice" is not good enough to play Jeremy in his first ever playoff game after not playing for over 5 weeks.
Imagine if you are Jeremy Lin or he is your brother asking for your opinion if he should come back soon.
What would you say? Of course you would say health first, long-term career and nothing else matters.
There are so many important medical questions to answer first.
1. How serious is Jeremy Lin's meniscus tear injury?
2. What is the estimated recovery time? ~6 weeks?
3. Is there possibility to have a long-term injury if one comes back too soon? (i.e. Brandon Roy retired in 2011 after he came back to 2010 playoff series only 8 days after surgery of partial meniscus tear similar to Jeremy)
I didn't know these answers and I'm not sure we have all the information out there to find out.
But with some digging, there are some gems out there. Sorry for the long post, but bear with me here.
Let me break it down into 3 posts.
1. How serious is Jeremy Lin's meniscus tear injury?
Deletehttp://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/chandler_eager_to_represent_usa_JyARK993TvKsgLo3HJCBFL
Because Lin had a “lateral’’ meniscus tear in his knee, it takes much longer to rehab than if it was a “medial’’ tear, according a person with knowledge of Lin’s situation. The Knicks originally did not disclose whether it was “medial’’ or “lateral’’.
Lin hoped to beat the six-week timetable, but that isn’t happening as his knee swelled up after surgery.
So we know its a "lateral" (the band that ran on the outside of the knee) meniscus tear and it takes longer to rehab.
2. What is the estimated recovery time?
According to the same article, the original six-week timetable recovery isn't happening because his knee swelled up after surgery.
And we know he experienced soreness after playing one-on-one with an assistant coach last week. He tried hard to get ready but his body is not responding well.
3. Is there possibility to have a long-term injury if one comes back too soon?
http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/09/26/nba-players-prone-to-serious-meniscal-tear/
This impressive study with 20 years of data reveals that NBA under-30 years old players suffered the more serious "lateral" meniscus tear than "medial" tear that normal people have.
Brandon Roy reportedly has no cartilage left in either knees causing bones to rub each other and forced him to retire. It can cause arthritis in the long-term.
While the 1 year performance using Hollinger PER shows the same result is interesting, it doesn't answer long-term implications. And there is a notion that a lateral tear is more serious and carries more long-term degenerative consequences.
What does this all mean? Those who took statistics class would say statistics can be misleading. I can even create a hypothesis that the reason why most lateral tear was on under 30-year old NBA players is because these players don't make it past 30 years old in the NBA. Brandon Roy was 27 years old when he retired in 2011.
Is this true? Well, more study is needed but if I was the NBA player, I don't need to the whole study to prove it. All I need to know that it is a possibility that Jeremy Lin can be the next Brandon Roy if he comes back too soon from "lateral" meniscus tear.
So if I were Jeremy Lin's brother, I would tell him to ignore all the bravados of coming back early and win 1 game for the Knicks because we might celebrate his retirement next year ala Brandon Roy. Better safe than sorry.
If he came back in Game 5, I hope he only played 5 min and the Knicks lost so he doesn't play in Game 6 or 7.
PS: Now I know Melo is on Jeremy's side because he told the media to expect Jeremy to come back next season so there is less pressure on him.
Thanks for the informative research.
DeleteJeremy Lin should not play. I don't agree that he would lose respect amongst his peers. He has already proven how dedicated he is to the game. Playing may seem to be proving manhood, but proving manhood may also involve stupid decisions. If manhood means brute mentality of playing through pain and creating hero stories, then many more reasoned decision makers would not be men.
And remember, if Jeremy Lin plays in Game 5 and Knicks actually pull off a win, he will also play the next game, with probably a expectation to shoulder more minutes.
You're welcome, wilsc.
DeleteI agree, Jeremy already proved his manhood to his teammates by always being there and doing all the drills and practices to try to come back early. That's what matters.
Finally, there is some serious lesson to learn from Brandon Roy who was a warrior but paid for it with early retirement.
ReplyDeleteFor a dose of reality for the braves only, check out the pictures posted by a doctor of 4 degrees of meniscus tear in this post for Brandon Roy
http://www.blazersedge.com/2010/11/15/1816820/brandon-roy-does-not-have-bone-on-bone-knee-arthritis
I know Brandon Roy already had chronic knee problems in college but if you looked at the total number of games in his 5 seasons, he actually played almost all 82 games in 07-09 before his injury in 09-10 season. Then he made the unwise decision of coming back 8 days after the surgery in in the playoff, won Game 4 against the Suns but lost the next 2 games and lost the series 4-2. And the minutes that he played in Game 4,5,6? It's 27, 19, and 37 minutes.
Brandon Roy's Career in 5 Seasons
Year G PPG Notes
06-07 57 16.8 ROY. Missed some games due to some injury
07-08 74 19.1 Almost a full season
08-09 78 22.6 Almost a full season
09-10 65 21.5 Meniscus tear. Came back early in Round 1 and lost 2-4 to the Suns.
10-11 47 12.2 PPG dropped almost 50%. Looked normal in the early season until December.
It's important to note that Brandon Roy was announced out indefinitely in Dec 2010 but had warrior mentality to come back in February althought his PPG is only 8 and lost the 1st playoff series against Dallas 2-4.
What is the moral of the story? Brandon Roy chose to be a warrior and came back early. Everything looked normal until the middle of next season. The Portland doctors cleared him and he wanted to play. He paid for it.
So Jeremy can choose the warrior path and might help to win 1 game. Or even the series without getting injured.
But will his next season be cut short? Will he forced to retired in 3 or 5 seasons too early? Noone really knows but would you risk it?
I'd say the Return of Investment is not worth it. 1 miraculous playoff series win vs 10-15 year of NBA career. I'd know what I choose.
I don't see Lin playing major minutes if he comes back.
DeleteIn fact, I'm not sure if I even see him playing AT ALL.
I'd like to see Woodson put Lin in at MSG just so the fans can cheer him. On the other hand, Woodson would be fine if he refused to make Lin a human victory cigar like Brian Scalabrine (how the heck did he play 10+ NBA seasons despite having NO GAME???)
totally agree with 234 and ntt:
Deleteto hell with Knicks. i want to see Jeremy thrive long term. Never be so shortsighted and risk long term career.
Jeremy, if you are reading this post (am sure you are!):
listen to me, bro:
In this business and any business, YOU ARE YOUR ONLY SAVIOR. If you don't put your interests first, NO ONE will!
Don't be fooled by so called "pressure" created by these selfish blogger or media who want you to play.
All the media cares is to make headlines so they can generate more revenues on their website;
all the blogger (here and anywhere) who want you to play want is INSTANT GRATIFICATION!
Disgusting.... has anyone considered the best interest FOR YOU, Jeremy! Think carefully.
If you feel slightest pain or soreness in the knee, DON'T GO.
rest well and fully recover in the summer. Improve your outside shooting, going left and on-ball defense.
No matter where you end up with (definitely should not be NY as you will turn into ordinary PG whose task is to just bring the ball up and shoot 3s), you will be fine.
When you are elected to HOF after 10 years, you will look back and say to yourself "I made a wise call in May 2012".
God blessed you and will always do as you have a good heart and soul.
In all likelihood, I bet Lin will make an announcement stating "I really wanted to play in game 5, but given the fact that I am not 100%, I felt that I would be a detriment rather than help to my teammates." I am almost 95% sure that he will make such statement before the game.
ReplyDeleteno, he won't.
DeleteHe will simply tell Woodson that he can't play as he still feel discomfort/pain/soreness. nothing more.
Knicks fan will forget all this in no time after Jeremy is traded away next season.
Why would we care this stupid Knicks team owned by a clueless owner?
It's clear that Jeremy's injury was the more serious type of meniscus injury than was first disclosed. The Knicks and their cult of secrecy are paying for it now because people are calling his integrity and courage (!??) into question. His injury was serious, it's taking time to heal and he should not be pressured to play in a series that is pretty much a foregone conclusion. I honestly can't understand people who think he should take the risk. For WHAT????? This isn't Game 7 of the series for goodness sake. Suddenly now the Knicks' fate hinges on Lin? GTFOH. If we're fans, we should all be hoping he is given the time to recover and recover PROPERLY. If he's medically cleared, then that's different. BUt he hasn't and apparently his doctors are advising against it. FOR A REASON. t want to see Lin playing for years to come. Urging him to rush back for frankly superfluous reasons is just plain foolish.
ReplyDeleteOk guys I am convinced that Jeremy should not to play since docc and himself have not come forward to declare he is ready
ReplyDeleteIndeed only Jeremy knows his body and feel
Let his parents famIly help him make decision
Most of you by now might have already read about the latest update on Jeremy's possibility to make a comeback this 1st round series is ZERO, as confirmed by Woodson.
ReplyDeletePhew, what a relief! ;>
Lin won't play.
ReplyDeletehttps://twitter.com/#!/HowardBeckNYT/statuses/199904339060457474
Mike Woodson actually did a good job of coming out in defense for Jeremy saying he's not ready to play. Hopefully Stephen A Smith can shut his trap now.
ReplyDeleteLooking at the big picture of where Jeremy Lin should play to have 10-20 NBA careers, I would propose us (Jeremy Lin faithful fans) to encourage him to play for Phoenix Suns.
ReplyDeleteWhy? Think about it this way.
"What is the single most important thing in Jeremy Lin's NBA career?" It should be his longevity because how else he would make an impact in the NBA and off-court ministry if he is not playing?
Even we will eventually stop blogging and making insightful comments in this blogsite.
There are two major reasons why Phoenix Suns (doctors) will be good for Jeremy. I also have a personal experience with Phoenix Suns orthopedic doctor that I will share with you.
1. Phoenix Suns have the best medical staff in the NBA
Grant Hill, Steve Nash, Michael Redd, Shaq.
The evidence speaks for itself. They are 35-40 years old players who rejuvenated their career after coming to or staying with Phoenix Suns.
This is a must-read article to hear what these players said about "The Secret behind Phoenix Suns Elite Medical Staff"
http://valleyofthesuns.com/2012/04/05/secret-behind-phoenix-suns-elite-training-staff/
...
In 2009-10 and 2010-11 the Suns amazingly lost just 20 such games to injury, tops in the league by an incredibly large margin. The Suns also missed only 13 rotation games during the magical 2004-05 season, according to this chart.
Basketball Prospectus’ Kevin Pelton measured health stats last year and found that only Oklahoma City lost less WARP than the Suns last year due to injury when Phoenix only missed out on 1.2 WARP despite an aging roster that featured Nash, Hill and the injury-prone vet Vince Carter.
...
2. Jeremy Lin's aggresive style of play is not conducive to long-term NBA career so he needs to adjust and also the best medical staff to look out for his interest
Most of us mentioned this already. He needs to pick and choose his spot. All the hard cut and stopping moves are quickly wearing off his meniscus and cartilage. I'm not saying stop changing how he plays but he needs to evolve, perhaps just do these amazing drive to the baskets in 4th quarters
The same article proved that the Suns’ medical staff is largely feted with praise thanks to their otherworldly efforts with the aging stars, but they have been just as good keeping the younger players healthy as well.
So while Jeremy can consult with them during the off-season like A-Rod from Yankees did, it does not replace the benefit of preventing injuries during the season.
As for my personal experience, I suffered a 3rd degree ACL tear from playing pick-up basketball 11 years ago but only decided to have ACL reconstructive orthopedic surgery 5 years ago with Dr. Thomas Carter who is the head team physician for Phoenix Suns. My knee used to buckle without any contact before the surgery and although I don't play competitive basketball against weekend warriors anymore, I can make cut left and right without any problems with my boys now. From my conversation with him about Steve Nash and other players, I learned that their team continuously monitored the players very well.
So fellow Jeremy fans, let's start petition to encourage Jeremy Lin to jump for joy if there is a possibility for him to play for Phoenix Suns.
Jeremy would have to forego the bright lights of New York and less marketing money but improve the possibility of playing for 10-18 years which optimize the most impact on-court and off-court for his ministries.
Disclosure: I live in Phoenix so there is a small chance I will benefit by watching Jeremy Lin play for Phoenix Suns :) But the numbers and what the aging players said don't lie, folks!
The only problem with Phx is that they overplay bad players while underpaying good players.
DeleteThe result are these freaky teams with overworked and disgruntled stars who end up leaving and fat happy underachievers who the Suns can't get rid of. Lottery status is the inevitable result.
As much as I'd love Lin to play in Phx, I'd rather him to a team that will properly pay and play him.
KHuang, who do you think is more inept in Phx? The owner (Robert Sarver) or the GM (Lon Babby)?
DeleteSarver kept selling draft picks like crazy and clearly was not willing to build championship team during Nash MVP years. For fans, he clearly just wants to be competitive enough to go to the first round of playoff and perhaps conference final so ticket sales will be brisk.
But what about Lon Babby as GM? Is he responsible for overpaying players?
And the whole thing about Steve Kerr abruptly left his GM position before was also fishy. Do you have any speculation?
Perhaps Phx is not willing to play for much but Alvin Gentry is a good coach. I would think the team is built around Nash and Jeremy can fill in his shoes to be the main playmaker, wouldn't you agree?
Even though I live in Phx, I don't follow the Suns closer than I follow other NBA teams. I know far more about the Indiana Pacers and San Antonio Spurs than I do about the Suns.
DeleteI haven't been the biggest Steve Kerr fan. Most of his moves have left me completely unimpressed. The only thing he did that really impressed me was trading for Shaq (I think Mike Dantoni pushed for that), and I LOVED the way Shaq played for the Suns before Steve Kerr traded him for less than nothing.
I was enraged when Kerr drafted superbust Robin Lopez ahead of Roy Hibbert (I went on youtube before he was drafted and predicted he'd become an All Star, which he indeed became). The Suns would have had a frontline of Shaq, Stat, and Hibbert. That would have made the Suns a perennial contender even if Shaq retired.
I hated Robin Lopez in college and would not even have drafted him in the 2nd round because he had a bad body AND couldn't play. Nope, he was drafted because he had the same HAIRCUT as Anderson Varejao who is a much more athletic and tough guy than the frail and uncoordinated Robin Lopez is. Kerr drafting him has set the franchise back and is a big reason why I don't follow the Suns. So even though I don't know why Kerr left, I am GLAD HE'S GONE.
I don't know what to make of Lon Babby. While Kerr inherited a good team, Babby inherited a mediocre one and has kept it mediocre. Guys like Shannon Brown, Josh Childress, and Sebastian Telfair shouldn't even be in the NBA. But Babby did make that EXCELLENT trade to get Marcin Gortat who I thought was overrated until Steve Nash started throwing him passes.
Sarver pays guys according to what he thinks their market value should be, not what it actually is. For example, Steve Nash has at least 2-3 good years left in him and is successfully battling off age. Thus I see Sarver lowballing Nash with something like a sub midlevel contract that will enrage Nash so much he walks.away. I would imagine that Jeremy Lin would be lowballed on contract negotiations, though his teammate Steve Novak is the type of limited role player Sarver likes to overpay.
On a purely basketball level, Jeremy Lin can start on any team in the NBA. I actually feel that Lin would help the Suns more than Nash would.
Thanks for sharing your insight, KHuang.
DeleteFor Robin Lopez, I remember the Suns liked his defensive skills better than his brother Brook Lopez and Kerr thought they can coach his offensive potential but the development has been really slow. It could be a work ethic issue as Marcin Gortat's presence has not challenged him to get better soon.
I always like Gortat's game because like Jeremy, he was very productive during limited minutes in Orlando while backing up Dwight Howard. So a PG upgrade from Jameer Nelson to Steve Nash would only help him even more.
Yes, this is a good trade because Gortat is CONSISTENTLY good.
I don't know enough about Shannon Brown, Telfair, Telfair because I stopped following the Suns closely when Sarver started selling draft picks like peanuts.
Why care so much when the owner doesn't?
I don't know why more teams don't copy the Spurs draft philosophy because they always find personnels with good characters and will fit their team first mentality. Anytime I tune to the Spurs game, I always see everyone works so hard out there and they care. It's a testament to Popovich as the coach and Tim Duncan as the leader/elder. I would say the Spurs is more of a dynasty than the Lakers since they are consistently good for a longer time.
Jeremy can definitely play for any teams but as you know NBA is a cutthroat business so you need to find a coaching and medical team that look out for Jeremy's best interests to play for a long term in the NBA. I don't like D'Antoni's approach to riding Jeremy like a Secretariat. The jury is still out on Woodson because he only said Jeremy shouldn't play the Heat series after Carmelo had 1:1 conversation with Jeremy telling him not to jeopardize his future by coming back. So I like Carmelo being the "big brother" looking out for Jeremy's interests.
Perhaps another alternative is to send the NY Knicks medical team for a crash course with Phoenix Suns on injury preventive management, kinesiology, balancing muscle strength, etc. since we know Jeremy most likely would still be in NY in 1-2 years. What Carmelo wants, Carmelo gets. Woodson, Lin, etc.
Copying the Spurs won't work because there is only ONE Tim Duncan who can carry a team all by himself. That guy is the best I've ever seen at making minor leaguers look like major leaguers!
DeleteIf the Suns really believed that Robin Lopez could defend at the NBA level, they are sorely mistaken. Lopez has already peaked, which is why he shrank when Gortat came in and took his job.
Jeremy Lin is a smart guy who will look out for hinself.
P
Psalm234: i agree with you on the Suns but i truly hope he stay with a team in East Coast as I'm in east coast. How about Bobcat!
ReplyDeleteI truly can't imagine Jeremy in Bobcat jersey!
DeleteJust giving you a hard time here :)
But MJ might be able to teach him a thing or two on court. And Jeremy can be a good influence off-court for MJ. LOL!
Perhaps we should poll which team should Jeremy end up with in 2-3 years.
Bobcat!
DeleteMJ is cheap guy as owner, so he won't pay arm/legs for superstar, which is good for Jeremy! So he can run the offense.
Then Bobcat needs to get a good coach with balanced offense/defense mindset. I will go after Nate McMillan who is allegedly interviewing the job.
can you image: MJ as owner and JL as PG? That will be huge marketing good mine for Chinese fans...
JLin in a be like Mike commercial v. 17
DeleteJordan's real problem is that he won't pay big dollars to anybody who he doesn't feel would pose a threat to him during his playing days.
DeleteThe problem with that is NOBODY is that good, not even Kobe. So Jordan throws his hands up and acts like there are no players.
It seems that Jordan is finally learning the lesson that totally eluded him as a player: that you have to believe in people and bring out the best in them instead of hurling them down a cliff and shouting "Get up".
That said, I've written before that Jordan should try to acquire Lin even if it means trading the #1 overall pick to get him.
DeleteI'd lock Jeremy Lin in Michael Jordan's private gym. Let them KILL each other. When Lin emerges, he'll be Jordan's little protege.
I've written that I've wanted Lin to train with Michael Ray Richardson (would be my TOP choice for Bobcats head coach), but Jordan is the ultimate teacher for Lin.
Jordan isn't very good at evaluating talent. That's why his Bobcats are so stint. Jordan is pretty bad as an owner and even worse as a GM. But, KHuang's comments make Jordan looks like the smartest person on the world. Do you think Jeremy Lin is worth a No. 1 overall pick? Im a huge Jeremy Lin fan, but it enrages me when people make stupid comparison that doesn't make sense. I could sense the level of KHuang's basketball knowledge when he's constantly claiming that Tim Duncan is the greatest basketball player of all time. Go figure...
DeleteAt least I am not like you saying on this board that Jeremy Lin doesn't belong in the NBA.
DeleteHaters like you hate.
Actually, I was being realistic. People like you comparing JLin to Michael Jordan (the greatest player in the history of the game, NOT DUNCAN) and making stupid claims make Jlin loses credibility and his fans base looks bad.
DeleteHe won't need to worry about money, no matter where he goes, there are 1.5 billion Chinese and growing... :-)
ReplyDeleteThe NBA is no different from any other American corporation, salivating over how much money they can exploit from the billions and billions of consumers in China and Asia.
DeleteJLin is their tool for doing this.
The doctors didn't clear him so it was open-and-shut.
ReplyDeleteAnd the Derrick Rose injury was probably a big wake-up call, too.
See you guys in October for Knicks preseason!
ReplyDeleteLin has some work to do over the summer.
Over the summer "homework":
Delete-Like people have been saying, he needs to pick his spots to attack the rim. Not only to reduce TOs but to reduce stress on his knee.
-Keep working on half-court playmaking. Hesitation dribbles. Bounce passes in traffic. Recognizing traps (and doing great counter-moves like the rematch in Philly).
-Stop doing that hard stop-and-pivot for a fadeaway jumper. It's an effective move, but it's murder on the knee. Not worth it.
-Team chemistry. Jeremy didn't really play that much with Melo AND Amare AND Tyson at the same time. And Fields had no jumper for most of the season.
The Knicks & Jeremy could be SCARY with a healthy roster and a full summer, training camp and preseason to prepare.
they wont' win with Mike Woodson as Head coach. He does not know how to spell offense.
ReplyDeleteWoodson knows how to spell offense "C-A-R-M-E-L-O"
DeleteThat's about it.
but it will be a good learning year for Jeremy, to learn some fundamentals of BB and half court set.
ReplyDeletehe better make sure only sign one year deal and fish the free market next summer.
woooooo, that will be a nice summer 2013...
I wonder if his surgery wasn't as successful as he had expected. The problem of soreness after practice is worrisome. I really hope he can heal completely and be stronger and better than he ever was as promised.
ReplyDeleteThe surgery was very successful.
DeleteIf Jeremy Lin were just a normal guy playing pickup ball, he'd be cleared to play based on his rapid recovery. However this is the NBA and that's far more strenuous than pickup ball.
I'd imagine that it'll take about 1 more month for Lin to feel 100%.
how do you know that his surgery was very successful? I am very worried about jeremy's knees. Two knee surgeries in two years. You just dont see that very often. And plus he barely played at all last year with golden state. This year he only really played in 20 gaems. This shows that his body probably isn't able to handle a NBA season and his style of play. I am very worried about his long term career.
DeleteYou are 100% correct about Jeremy Lin currently being unable to handle a full NBA season.
DeleteJeremy Lin went from playing almost no minutes to playing major minutes against teams that played him extremely physically. Though Lin was successful in firmly establishing himself as a NBA player, the price he paid was knee surgery.
Now that Lin will be entering a full offseason to strengthen his body and prepare for the NBA grind, Lin be more than ready for next season. He'll get proper coaching, have a designated rotation role, and will have worked on the weaknesses in his game.
Remember that Lin bounced around the league and didn't even know if he'd stick in the NBA a few months ago. He went from sleeping on his brother's couch to being triple teamed by the Heat in like two weeks. Next season, Lin won't go from being the forgotten man to the designated target of triple teams.
Lin will adjust his game and play well in the NBA for a long time.
This was obvious. They have no shot in winning the series. On top of that, Jeremy is making the minimum salary this season. He would be a fool o play in this game. There must have been pressure from his camp to sit it out and wait til he gets his contract first and that's the right move to do. This is a business, and everyone in the nba is out for themselves. The moral of te story: just do your job, get paid, and go home. These people are not playing for pleasure. This is a job and the players have family and personal lives to attend outside of the game.
ReplyDeleteI'm happy for Jeremy because he's getting paid more and will have a fresh start next season. My guess is he won't be back in NY next season because of lack of chemistry among the players, but he will be playing for a team that really needs him and that's all he really cares about. Leave the fake media drama out and you will see what's really going on..
-Nemo
In the beginning of the season, we were happy if Jeremy even got just 20 minutes a game. He has exceeded expectations greatly. We should be great full the reporters are even bringing him up, because he easily could have fallen through the cracks this season either being waived, sent permanently to the dleague, or still played the 12th man role and being inactive for the playoffs.
DeletePositive or negative, getting exposure means that he is a somebody.
DeleteFrom a business standpoint, the Knicks might be better off not playing Lin even if he wants to. Playing him would let everyone know if the knee is sound. That is just showcasing him to other teams who might make him an offer. If other teams can't be sure, they might not do so. This would actually allow the Knicks to make a lower bid to Lin.
ReplyDeletePerhaps a good scenario would be that the Knicks sign Steve Nash with the Mid Level Exemption and offer Lin a lower, back-loaded contract. I would like to see Lin learn from Nash, then blossom into a superstar, kind of like an Aaron Rogers/ Bret Favre kind of thing.
I'm much more intrigued by JL's continued non-committal statement about his future. Also, he praises "New York" not just MSG. Brooklyn, ahem...
ReplyDeleteSo if D-Will bolts the Nets (which he probably will), and Brooklyn offers Lin that 4-year backloaded contract...I think Jeremy would probably sign that offer sheet. That would force the Knicks to match and they might not if they can get Nash instead.
Heh.
ReplyDeleteWhile I don't agree with the article, there is the fact that Jeremy is not a NBA veteran whose years of conditioning and will overcome a physical injury.
As far as the haters go, those are the same people who'd be clamoring for Lin NOT to be playing if he were healthy. So since they aren't going to be happy no matter what, worrying about their opinions is pointless.
I hope we re not talking about this again for game six. I enjoyed reading all the comments but it got quite heated with some bloggers. Who knew a meniscus would draw such attention.
ReplyDeleteThe Knicks lose.
ReplyDeleteThe season is OVAH.
Put a fork in New York.
Wow, Melo took the same number of shots as James and Bosh combined. Stat had 7 shots? Didn't watch the game since JLin wasn't playing anyway. But if that is a healthy Stat, 7 shots is just crazy. It seemed JR was firing away all right.
ReplyDeleteLooking forward to next season.
I don't know if everyone had a chance to read this article: http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7913991/nba-playoffs-2012-jeremy-lin-new-york-knicks-most-important-player-2013 . It's a great article, and the two key points I extrapolated from this article were:
ReplyDelete(1) As I stated in a previous post, the Knicks were going nowhere with Melo iso-ball and Tyson Chandler pretty much quoted that same sentiment. I also laughed when the Knicks matched up with Miami because I know they were going to get crushed. I was happy this happened because I knew that this would teach Melo a lesson about what it takes to win- a team.
(2) Jeremy needs to learn to play the politics better- perception is everything. He shouldn't have said that "he was at 85 percent". He shouldn't have quantified the percentage and left the whole situation unclear. The only thing that should have been clear was that this could be seriously impacting his future career, and the doctors told him not to play at all. As a Lin fan and after watching him this past year, I know what he's about and what he is willing to do to win. Unfortunately, not all people see it the same way and all of the haters are coming out to roost. It's a good lesson for him on how to deal with these situations moving forward.
I think JLin is more than a little bit naive about how the world really works and the (not so) benevolent intentions of the media, the NBA, and the fans, whom he is always praising.
DeleteThese same people who claim to cheer you on or build you up will be the same people that throw you under the bus when it serves their interests.
Welcome to the shark tank, Jeremy.
It's sink or swim.
I wonder if you guys know that Nash has already joined Toronto as a GM. It was reported in the newspaper here, in Canada.
ReplyDelete