Yeah, that last second 3-pointer by JLin to close the half. That speaks volumes about his character. He deserves to be an NBA star, anything less would be a wasted of his skill and hard work.
Btw. Baron Davis left the game with a strained hamstring.
Woodson was probably told by the Knicks management to stop putting down Lin in the public. They know nothing good can come out of that for them business-wise
Commenting on... ESPN's article titled: 'Davis Out With Right Hamstring Injury' March 16, 2012 9:13 PM -----------------------
Oh Boy.... This is getting really interesting in a slimy sort of way - transpiring egos, greed, and jealousy.
Ever since Mike D was out, for 2 days Woodson has been taking a lot of thinly-veiled cheap shots and insults at Lin and Mike D; then he was told to damage control on behalf of himself and the organization with "Lin is our starting PG... blah blah", all the while fully expecting Jeremy Lin to do badly in the "conventional" system, at which point Woodson can revert back to his original plan to make Baron Davis the starter - then marginalizing Lin would be justified in the minds of the public.
But since Davis is again injured during this game - and since Lin played well (what the f !$#! surprise!) and the trade deadline has passed - Woodson may be forced to behave more neutrally (that's like kissing his axx) towards Lin, NOW THAT Woodson NEEDS Lin.
Users!.....
-- Use Lin for winning
-- Use Lin for greed (over hyping to the point of Lin's "teammates" not coming to his aid when 3 Mavericks players (ironically happens to be a white guy, a black guy, and a hispanic) ganged up on Lin in an attempt to break his neck and give him brain damage on March 6th)
-- Use Lin for scapegoating (when it was Carmelo's "my way or the highway" attitude)
-- Win a few games after the shake up (which always happens)
-- For the 2nd time scapegoat Lin... for the 2nd time, Lin is a "fluke" (I'm guessing another losing streak due to more things not going melonoma's way)
Stop using and abusing Lin!... You've got a decent PG almost for free!!!!!!.... You (Dolan) have already made a ton of $$$$$ off of him (for you, it's not about the fan - only business and greed).... You've ordered a shrimp but got a lobster instead.... Stop complaining already!
It's clear what's going on here. Linsanity has become too big to reverse. I'm sure Woodson had in mind to slowly phase out Jeremy in favor of Baron, but this is where the top management and comes in to intervene. They knew if they killed Linsanity, the Knicks will ultimately lose money. With Baron close to his last straw in his career, his value and future potential just isn't there. Pretty simple. Tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Like Jeremy, I too have an economics degree ;) - Nemo
Jeremy is so grounded; I don't know how and why he can play so well for Woodson, who have pretty much trashed Lin in the media, over-flexing his new coaching muscle, not thinking of anything else except to please Carmelo.
I know Lin is paid to play his best and he must be a professional, BUT with Woodson's garbage mouth, why "validate" the firing? This is one of the reasons why I believe Lin will do better IF he could play with the 2nd group; that way Lin (and other good guys) will do well AND the Knicks still lose.... Now, with Davis' injury (again), it's less likely for Woodson to implement his not-so-secret desire.
There's always an initial bump with coach change (even the T Blazers won over the Bulls). I don't think the Knicks will make the playoffs, and I no longer root for them..... Regardless, Lin will do fine.
Good game overall for Lin. He played some good D on Darren Collison, forcing him to take some tough shots.
Negatives: Forced a few bad passes when being harassed by the defense. Needs to stop trying to pass OVER defenders, it will get deflected away. This is the NBA, every defender can jump.
Some silly reach in fouls on post players going to the rim. If he's not going to block the shot, don't try.
Good points. I hope they're running some special drills for him in practice because this is obviously a situation that will pop up over and over again.
Simulate a successful hard trap by "stopping the clock," putting two defenders around him, giving Jeremy the ball, and starting the clock again. Then give him three seconds to safely pass the ball out of the double-team.
Practice drills can only get you so far. It takes real game experience to understand how to beat a hard trap.
Kind of like how players can shoot lights out at shootaround but miss their jumpers when the game is on the line. It will take some experience, and unfortunately some turnovers before he learns.
In the meantime, it's good that Lin doesn't need to drive to the basket every time on offense. If he can learn to use the opponent's "Fear of the drive" to create space for shots and open passing lanes. That will keep him from getting beat up going into the lane all the time.
Anybody else notice how radically different the offense looks now? I can barely remember one Pick N roll. Jeremy was a mere decoy on a ton of possessions. The ball definitely runs through Melo's hands now. Most of Jeremy's assists tonight were of the "heads-up", fast break/ cherry-picking variety. He is no longer the initiator of the offense.
I know you love Lin and I do too but come on he played a good game just be happy. I actually want Melo and Amare to play well also. It takes the pressure off of Lin. It's good they got a win. Go Lin!
From the performance of the recent games plus tonight's, are the superstars still superstars now? We should all let Woodson know that we seriously challenge the "superstar" status.
Maybe in a crazy way, what you are asking for is exactly what Woodson wants.
Keep in mind that basketball is a fluid game that requires coaches to change philosophy in the fly. A coach will do one thing and then have to scrap it entirely when the opponent responds differently.
If anybody can play well through basketball's fluidity, it's Lin who is on his "6th or 7th system" in less than 2 years!
Playing without the ball in his hands as much can help him. He doesn't need to create off the bounce as often, can catch and shoot more. He can also utilize his jab step and super-quick first step after he catches. This will probably leave him more energy for defense.
Either way he's a good ball player with great fundamentals so he'll be just fine.
Heard the announcer say Davis pulled a hammi...here comes that injury history of his. Hope it's not too bad. The Knicks will need him to give JLin some rest. Overall, great game from JLin and the Knicks. It's fun to watch team basketball and defense!
Yeah I was thinking that was right no cue lol. He is def injury prone and that could be God's way of letting Jeremy know he is the starting pg : ) Baron played really well for the short time he played but NO ONE should be surprised that he pulled his hamstring.
Like the rest of the team, it looked like Davis gave extra effort on O and D. He played well - well enough to fuel the Davis v Lin debate.
But in playing well, Davis pushing his legs harder than usual likely led to his pulled hamstring. End of debate: Lin's game may be more flawed and he's inexperienced, but Davis is brittle with a long injury history. Davis needs to be handled with care, which means moderating his playing pace, minutes, and role.
But it says a lot about Melo's selfish personality that he wouldn't play defense if the offense didn't run through him... Still hope that JLin can get away from this kind of teammate next season.
Lin Played a decent game tonight but had 3 t/o in 26 minutes of play.. Those seemed like mental lapses that could had been avoided. It was an overall good game none the less. He played some good D as well. Next challenge is tomorrow. Pacer will want pay back.
Yeah what is this whole new energy coming out of every knicks player? Was there a conspiracy to get Mike D'antoni fired? Carmelo has this swagger like he's won something.
Woodson flip flopping on his comment about Lin being benched to Lin is still the starting point guard is crazy!
I hope Jlin goes to the spurs or mavs next year where he can learn from very good pg veteran like parker and kidd. Although he may not get the starting job he will learn alot from those vets, because I'm sure B. Davis is not trying to teach JLin anything. Deep inside B. Davis is hating on JLin, Melo, Stoudamire are hating on Lin.
Don't you guys feel like Jlin is like Jackie Robinson of Baseball who broke the color barrier in baseball. Racism is not dead, it still lives dormant in society. Linsanity has sprouted that dormant racist thoughts and has been exposed to the public. I think as Asian Americans and Asian immigrants we need to voice our opinion about how sports analysts, media, and the NBA sometimes degrade Jlin's skills and ability. I know they are doing this just because he's Asian. They just can't accept that an Asian guy can actually be a good and potentially become a superstar basketball player.
They already hate on us Asian because they think that we're all stereo-typically smart and should leave black/white dominated sports alone.
I do appreciate that other people who are not asian can see the truth about Jlin and speak the truth about his skills. I just hate obvious racists who would say anything just to degrade Jlin's game.
I don't really see that they hate him. If you think Melo, Amare and davis hates him then what makes you think the people on other teams won't hate him too.
The worst that can happen is that Lin turns the ball over too much and guys continue to have low percentage shooting nights against him.
If Lin plays the way we know he can play, he will continue to be a valuable NBA starter for years to come. Anybody that benches Lin had better replace him with a player that Lin cannot humiliate daily in practice. The haters will come at him and Lin will SMACK THEM DOWN the way he's been punking Baron Davis in practice.
The racists fear most an Asian American champion who can kick their butts intellectually and physically. Jeremy Lin is that champion - and so can YOU be too.
I'd rather Lin get in the game and learn by playing than sit behind an established star. Besides, Lin has been terrific as a starter. I will keep saying that Linsanity rages on until Lin is knocked out of the league.
I honestly don't get why you guys keep bringing racism into the equation. If your gonna take a knock at melo and stats opinion of Lin, at least criticise their ego. Honestly, there really is nothing you can claim that suggest both these guys are racists. In fact some of you used to say mike d was a racist for burying Lin on the bench. It's pretty obvious now mike wasn't..
I am watching the SA vs OKC now. I got over the JLin reducing his role a little bit right now.
I now think that the new offense may give JLin an excellent chance to improve his mid range game, 3 point shooting and court management. It will make him to become a more all-around player. I mean Tony Parker when he first came into the league also had to face the task of feeding the ball to Duncan in the half court when he was clearly better in the open court but he learnt and adapted, now he is great at nearly all the aspects. I remember that Parker also had tons of TOs and got benched a lot of times when he was young as well. And same for Nash when he had to feed Finley and Dirk in his Dallas days.
I hope that JLin will be learning the same way as Parker and Nash in their younger days and then eventually when he gets into a new team or the so called stars get older he will have an offense built around his talents and develop into a true superstar. Short term, it may be bad for JLin and his many fans. But long term, it will be a great scenario! But he and us as fans will need to accept and learn the short team pains!
To be honest, I feel that Tony Parker play the pick and roll and in the open court really very similar to our JLin...
We here in jeremylin.net are veteran basketball watchers who understand that the game isn't about statistics and superstars and all that. We LOVE what Lin is doing, even when he wasn't getting much of a chance to do it.
You are correct that all good PGs go through the struggles Lin has. Lin is WAY AHEAD of any young pg except for maybe John Wall and possibly Kyrie Irving. Lin has All Star talent and will make the team at some point in his career no matter who's coaching him.
One more thing. Tony Parker wouldn't be "Tony Parker" without the great Tim Duncan setting those picks for him. Put Parker on another team and he'd look like a #29 pick and not an All Star.
You guys aren't seriously complaining about not having the offense go through Lin are you?? They just trashed another team yet again, that's twice they made two teams the Knicks bitches.. Look as long as Lin is starting and the Knicks are beating their opponents by a wide margin, I could care less if he scores less than 5 pts... This is good for Lin to be honest, it means he won't be injury prone and he'll have a long lasting career in the NBA...
As long as THIS is what the Knicks' new look offense is, I'm all for it.
It's just that before the game, Woodson, Amare, the entire sports media, and even Jeremy all strongly suggested they were going to play a lot more iso-ball, with the fake-superstars going one-on-one as much as possible.
But again, if this the what Woodson has in mind, then HECK YEAH, I'm all for it. This was team-ball with great defense.
I still don't understand how anyone can idolise Carmelo Anthony. I mean it is very laugable to me that now he tries to play defense, team ball and pass unselfishly when he finally gets everything his way and his wish. It is also very funny that people dismiss Jeremy as a system player but in fact Carmelo is the one who didn't even bother to show up in games when he wasn''t the lone featured player. The more unselfishly he plays now, the more selfish of a player he shows, in my opinion.
But with Jeremy, he now may not get the offense built around him but he will continue to work hard that is no doubt in my mind. His defense, hustle, passing ability, heart, never say die attitude and all around skills will not disappear in any games and any systems, unlike his one certain teammate!!
And I personally have not much respect for this new coach either. I mean how far you can go as a coach if you are just a "listening to stars" and "listening to management" guy. I doubt he has much respect from the players as well. In his mind, he also knows that if Carmelo could force MDA out, he could also force him out as well. Haha...
Passing along: to vote for your favorite athletes in New York. http://espn.go.com/newyork/bracket/mostbeloved Semifinal is next week. Cut and paste the website and vote for JLin.
You are darn right I'm unhappy even though they won. Why am I unhappy?
(1) This article pretty much sums it up: http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/20299/carmelo-anthony-joy-wrecker . Instead of this beautiful fluid offense that we saw in the 7 game win-streak, we're stuck with the stagnant ISO Melo-ball offense that we're going to see moving forward. I've been so disgusted I couldn't watch the game today, and I'm not sure I'll be able to watch the Knicks moving foward. Believe me, I want to support jlin as much as anyone, but it's just too painful right now to watch.
(2) So...now Carmelo finally decides to get motivated and play defense,rebound, and share the ball (5 assists tonight). Where was this when they were losing 6 straight games? Where was this when Jlin had an MVP play and completely shut down Brandon Jennings. How come Carmelo didn't get the defensive rebound...I watched that play 7 times straight and that was Carmelo's man and not Amare's fault at all!!! What happened to defense/rebounding in SA, Chicago, 76ers, and even the Milwaukee game? Guys on this team (Carmelo for sure..who else..I'm not sure) quit and yes I'm not happy. Check this link out for verification: http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/14374/amare-we-didnt-all-buy-in-so-mda-quit. Marsh-melo could have tried to fit into Dantoni's system and it might have worked, but he always wanted to be top dog and never second-fiddle.
(3) Woodson doesn't seem to bright to me though I know it's too early to tell. I base this on the fact that he's handled the media like a rookie coach would. He was trying to show support for his two biggest "stars" with his comments while completely alienating jlin. This was a big mistake and a bad political move that he had to backtrack on. I think it kind of shows his true nature though. I'm iffy on how he will treat Jlin moving forward long term. In the short-term, he''ll have to appease the fans and media by playing jlin a lot, but the minute he struggles..... I hope I'm wrong on this.
(4) I guess one thing that I am happy about is that jlin has less pressure on him which will give him some time to develop, but this system won't ever allow jlin to become a superstar. On one hand, I am satisfied even now with all of the incredible things that have happened to him and am so proud of what he's done. On the other hand, I think the potential is there for greatness, but it likely won't happen with this coach and this system. He'll be a solid role player at best. Woodson has a history with Atlanta of throwing the ball into Josh smith and Joe Johnson while alienating everyone else on the team.
(5) My prediction: Knicks will make playoffs and actually will do well for the rest of the season. They might even make it into the second round of the playoffs. They'll never be championship material with what they have currently. I think the "mailman" Carmelo Anthony who mailed in effort, defense, and rebounding to get rid of the coach and get the system he wanted in place will be the most motivated he's ever been. With the distraction of the rift in the locker room and coaching situation gone, they will play better and this will continue through the end of the season. However, at some point, the deficiencies in the system/Carmelo centric system will show up again next year unless something dramatically changes ie Camelo is traded and a new coach is hired.
Come to think in another angle, I think we dont need to worry too much about Jeremy. I think he will be decent and solid in this limited role. Actually now all the pressure is on Carmelo, if he cant produce some results, there is a bigger chance of him being booed out of the New York City, and I highly doubt that he can do anything special with his style. Jeremy will be okay. By the time Carmelo contract finishes, Jeremy is still only 26-27 years old. Although we dont want to see him waste his time in this bad organized franchise, keep in mind that he will be still be very young and very much in his prime, he then can get out of NY or NY management may have changed to be better. Steve Nash did not become MVP until being traded at 30. If Jeremy can continue to work hard, there is no doubt in my mind that he can have a similar career. Just that he may also need to take his time and wait for his chance like Nash when he was young. How ironic! Also Jeremy has a high chance of being voted in as an All Star even he is just a solid starter!
One more think if Jeremy is as good as we think he can be he should be able to shine in any system or even he is not being featured in offense. No doubt MDA system is prefect for him but he should not do too bad in other systems as well. By the time he plays well, more recognition will come because people can no longer dismiss him as a byproduct of a certain system!
JLin is not ready right now to be a star; it's better for him to keep playing at least 20+ minutes per game in any role and keep improving. If he can show his versatility and can play in different systems, his value and chance of playing in NBA for long term will increase significantly because one thing he has that most other NBA players do not have is the same marketing power and the ability to bring in new fans to the game because of his ethnicity and his educational background, his being well-spoken and down-to-earth and the fact he wears his religion/faith on his sleeves. NBA needs JLin just as badly to expand NBA to the Asian markets, so if I were JLin, I would just focus on improving steadily and let things happen around him. The worst thing that can happen to him at this stage in his career is for any team to have to depend on him as the "star" of the team. The fact that Linsanity happened is because no friggin people expected any of this and other Knicks players rallied around him and what he stood for.
still don't understand how anyone can idolise Carmelo Anthony. I mean it is very laugable to me that now he tries to play defense, team ball and pass unselfishly when he finally gets everything his way and his wish. It is also very funny that people dismiss Jeremy as a system player but in fact Carmelo is the one who didn't even bother to show up in games when he wasn''t the lone featured player. The more unselfishly he plays now, the more selfish of a player he shows, in my opinion.
But with Jeremy, he now may not get the offense built around him but he will continue to work hard that is no doubt in my mind. His defense, hustle, passing ability, heart, never say die attitude and all around skills will not disappear in any games and any systems, unlike his one certain teammate!!
And I personally have not much respect for this new coach either. I mean how far you can go as a coach if you are just a "listening to stars" and "listening to management" guy. I doubt he has much respect from the players as well. In his mind, he also knows that if Carmelo could force MDA out, he could also force him out as well. Haha
I decided to give in and actually watch the game tonight on League pass replay. I have a few observations: (1) Did the invasion of the body snatchers happen 2 nights ago and did these invaders take over Carmelo Anthony's body and replace it with someone who plays defense, rebounds, passes, and does all the little things to win basketball games? The more likely scenario is Marshmello is highly motivated to prove the naysayers wrong. He wants to prove that Dantoni was the problem and he didn't kill linsanity (even though he did), cause the 6 game losing streak (even though he did), and that he is all about the team/winning. (2) I only watched the first half. Marshmello took 3 awful shots, one 3 with 23 seconds left on the shot clock contested.....awful. He did have a few really nice passes since all of sudden the body snatchers have brought in a new team player. (3) The offense with Jeremy looked much better than I thought it would. I guess that's what happens when your defense opens up easy scoring opportunities. Jeremy had a sweet pass to Carmelo off of great defense in the second quarter. Also, Carmelo wasn't the black hole he usually is which is probably key. (4) The system is still broken because of Carmelo. His shot selection is still awful, and he will want his stats at some point. He won't deal with going 4-12 like he did tonight and losing...he' rather put up his 22 shots and "take over" once they start losing again. (5) Woodson took out Jeremy at the 6 minute mark for Baron. I'm still guessing we're looking at average of 25 min/game for him with BD/Shump taking the rest of the minutes. They played a lot more pick and roll then I thought which is definitely a positive.
I'm perfectly fine with Lin not being the "superstar" that every single opponent has circled on their calendar and bringing their A+ game against a mediocre team. Like others said, as long as Lin is the starter, contributing, and the team is winning, then it's great. That's better than if Lin were scoring 20+ pts a night while the team is losing. This would show the league Lin's versatility, he can be the focal point of the offense, or he can be a facilitator.
I agree with you that taking that bulls-eye off of Jeremy's back is a really good thing. This will allow him to develop as I mentioned before. The point I am making is that the team **should** have gone 4-2 in that stretch during the losing streak if Carmelo hadn't mailed it in and quit. Most of the issues were not on offense..they were are all defense which as you know is all about effort.This could and should have been Jeremy AND Carmelo's team (if he tried to fit in the system), but now it's clearly Melo's team (see D wade and Lebron James). I don't think Jeremy needs to be a superstar at this point in his career (though I think his play was nearly there in the Dantoni era), but I will be really unhappy if 25 minutes per game is the norm while seeing Jeremy do all the little things to win (defense, rebounding, passing) while Carmelo gets the credit. Carmelo will be more motivated than ever so I predict they will win a lot more games, but there will be a limit to how far this team will go moving forward unless he completely changes his game.
Carmelo Anthony is one of the most blatantly selfish players I have seen in a long time. It was more than sickening to watch his whining on not getting the ball under D’Antoni. Instead of acting like a professional and doing his best under a system that he didn’t like (that’s why he’s paid millions and millions of dollars), he sulked and slithered around like Gollum, casting aspersions and eating away at the team’s overall morale. He would rather lead a team to a sub-par performance under his quasi-leadership than allow Lin to bring a championship to long-suffering Knicks fans.
Alas, every hero story needs a villain and Anthony fits the part. His passive-aggressive sabotage of the Knicks stopped the momentum the Knicks had with Linsanity, drove coach D’Antoni away, and poisoned the locker room. What Anthony and most people do not realize (including uber-Lin fans), is that the Lin story is much bigger than they can possibly even comprehend. Lin will prevail and no matter how petty and ultimately self-destructive Anthony acts, he will not be able to change this.
It’s pathetic that the Knicks, as an organization, is so dysfunctional. What is so hard about waiting for the right players and coaches to come along? Why do the Knicks perpetually over-pay over-rated players? Over and over and over again? The Knicks won the ultimate Powerball lottery with Jeremy Lin and the organization is veering towards throwing it away rather than cashing in!
With all of the resources the Knicks have at their disposal, the Knicks should be a perennial play-off threat. I think that’s what kills Knicks fans the most; the fact that the team has so much potential but consistently squanders it away for no good reason. What the Knicks have come to symbolize is that human beings are not rational beings; rather rationalizing beings capable of rationalizing away the most idiotic, short-sighted, and stupid decisions.
Dolan is a pathetic owner incapable of managing the Knicks organization. Carmelo is no Jordan or Kobe or Lebron. He is not in basketball shape and he cannot be reasoned with, at least in his current Gollum-like incarnation. I appreciate the fact that Dolan can recognize talent, however, talent may be the most over-rated phrase when it comes determining whether or not a person will succeed. Talent coupled with a bad attitude and hubris (and let’s talk straight, Carmelo has both attributes in spades) is a recipe for disaster. Dolan can’t recognize this simple fact and needs to take responsibility for the Knicks current dysfunctional state.
Melo is not an all-around talented player who can defend in the mold of Jordan, Kobe or LeBron. You can't just shoot a lot and score 23 points per game and call yourself a great player. It's very deceiving the way media tries to convince people someone is talented. Stat has lost any explosiveness and is routinely blocked when he tries to take the ball to the basket, and he is not strong enough to go up for the shot, which in essence makes pick and rolls not very effective. As long as these two players clog up the money, Knicks will just be either no playoff or early playoff exit team. Despite this, Knicks fans want to see them play team basketball.
I see the most talent in Schumpert and Chandler actually, as well as JLin, definitely not in these so-called stars.
I think it is actually pretty good, especially if the formula from the last 2 games stays the same. They are playing fun team basketball. I am hearing rumors that there was an airing out among the team-mates and everyone, including Melo committed to playing unselfishly. Read it on a board somewhere but can't seem to find it again. With all the RIP talk, I always felt that Lin is already so marketable, his fans can stop wringing their hands.
Actually the last two games are some kind of honeymoon period more than the norms imo. The moment the Knicks start to lose some games again, the fingerpointing and selfishness will show again. I really dont think deep down Jeremy has fun playing with such teammates. I think the most smart choice will be taking the QO for 1 year and then exploring his options the year after that. In that way he can has choice of a team that really fits him and values him. And it can also force the Knicks into making some changes to keep Jeremy happy if they want to keep him.
Let's not get too excited people, they won against a team who had a poor night, plus they won at home which has certainly boosted their game particularly during the linsanity period.
Anthony and Stat are dragging the Knicks down with their old man's game.
Stat relies on the outside shot where he prefers space or the easy basket while growling at the camera like he's just dunked on 6 people. Overhyped.
Anothony plays like a black hole, sucking the ball and offense towards him. His lack of effort on the defensive end might actually be because he no longer has the energy he once had, perhaps hiding a physical ailment. He relies completely on his offensive game to prove his worth. I never understood the hype behind this guy, Dominic Wilkins and Shawn Kemp were both flashy players but they were far more effective than Anthony. I guess growing up and learning from the most selfish player of all time, Allen Iverson, helped made him the player he is today.
It would be difficult to ship him out because this Dolan guy seems just as bad an owner as the LA Clippers guy. Lin's chance to develop further would have to be as a 6th man on the Knicks or on another team (most likely one that's a work in progress).
I agree that Knicks will never be title contender or go deep in playoffs because these two guys are not that good. Knicks might make it to playoff because of the players in the second unit and let's face it, you don't even have to have 50% record to make it to playoff which is a joke really and designed to carry move games on TV so NBA can make more money. I rather have a smaller pool of bona-fide contenders make it to playoffs.
Woodson should realize he's got a gift handed to him by dantoni. He shouldnt mess with Linsanity. Its the year of the Dragon baby! Lin is A dragon. Its all meant to be. If anything he should bring it back with his own version of linsanity 2.0. Be the defensive man you are and make your star players own up and play D. Dragon and Defense. D&D all the time! Dont mess up a good thing Woodson. Its meant to be!
We shouldn't forget that Coach Woodson was a first-hand witness of Linsanity, too.
Billups last year famously remarked that Anthony can do it all, when he wants to. Clearly, Anthony didn't want to do it for D'Antoni. The difference in Anthony's game since D'Antoni left, particularly his defense, is stark. Passive-aggressive Anthony didn't want to play for D'Antoni and wants to play now.
Lin's half-court defense has improved in that he's making a better effort to stick with his man and fight over screens, but Collison was still getting past him. The bigger difference in the Pacers game is Lin was able to recover because the help rotation has improved back to where it was during Linsanity. Against the Pacers, the same opposing PG drives that were going unmolested to the basket or turning into wide open assists during the losing streak were cut off.
Going from the D'Antoni system to the Woodson system is a trade-off, but not a bad trade-off for Lin.
The D'Antoni system really died when Anthony and Stoudamire returned. Anthony because he's a focal point that clashed with D'Antoni's system and Stoudamire because of his clogging the pick-and-roll space with Chandler. At the point the team on the floor no longer fit the system, the question of D'Antoni's system as the best fit for Lin became moot.
But good teams had adjusted their defense to Lin, too. Lin isn't Nash - not yet anyway. D'Antoni's system revolves around the PG. It can't be understated how heavily the system relies on the PG. D'Antoni relies on his PGs to use the full range of their skills. At the same time, however, opponents understand that if they can contain the PG, they can shut down the whole offense. D'Antoni's system encourages opposing defenses to focus on the PG. It also leaves the PG fairly naked in dealing with those defenses. The PG must have enough ball-handling skills to go where and when he wants to go, rather than where and when the defense forces him to go. The PG must be able to read, react, and counter quickly to stay ahead of the defense. In short, D'Antoni's system highlights a PG's strengths, but also exposes his weaknesses. Lin's flaws as an inexperienced PG with a combo-guard handle were exposed when good teams adjusted to him and applied a high level of pressure. Lin's ball handling skills fell short, and as early as the Timberwolves game where Rubio hounded him, the limits of his (half) court vision and passing were exposed.
Against the Pacers, Lin had the same difficulty handling the ball under pressure, with some ugly turnovers, but as we saw last night, the switch to Woodson's system eases the pressure from being a D'Antoni PG. Lin was a scoring guard before the NBA, not a point guard - the bigger adjustment for Lin has been to PG. Going to more of an off-the-ball role under Woodson is a return to Lin's game, not a departure.
I'm optimistic. Granted, it's just one game (I don't count the awful Blazers game), but it looks like Woodson's system preserves enough of Lin's strengths to allow him to be productive, while also helping to mitigate Lin's weaknesses. Lin has shown enough potential. Someday, he may be able to handle a Nash-level load of the offense as a D'Antoni PG against top defenses, but he's not there not yet. It took Steve Nash a few years to become Steve Nash, too.
Talking about fighting over screens. JLin said after the game he saw every screen coming at him because the bigs were active in calling out oncoming screens. As a result, it made easier for Jlin to go around and anticpate the screens. So what happened when D'Antoni was there? Did the bigs intentionally wanted JLin to fail or what? I'm just furious all of sudden these so called "superstars" or "egostars" are playing with a high intensity.
Also, as you alluded to the defensive rotations were back to the way it was during Linsanity. Furthermore, I didn't really see that much of a change. Everything seems pretty much status quo except the pick-n-roll is virtually nonexistent. Melo still out on the wings most of the time. When Jlin brings the ball up, you see Stat and Chandler post up and JLin would pass to either one of them instead of a pick-n-roll and moves from the ball to a screen to free Melo. The only difference obviously is the cranked up defensive intensity. I feel the change of intensity is just a matter of not to lose face for the "superstars." We'll see if this can last. Of course, I hope it works out because I do want the team to succeed because of Jlin.
The key was that they didn't switch off on defense every time like they did under D'Antoni. Only bad switchups were when Anthony was defending Daren Collison and he got burned for a layup, Lin was guarding Danny Granger who was backing him down in the lane, but fortunately Lin was able to draw the offensive foul.
But overall, the Knicks played great team defense, didn't switch, and went after loose balls.
This time Knicks had the benefit of getting some home foul calls. On the road it will be a different story, so they need to play near perfect basketball on the road.
Good post. I have to agree that it's really pretty much the same system that they ran. I didn't really see any ISO plays for Melo or Amare moreso than the previous games. The only difference is really the renewed effort on defense that Amare and Melo displayed last night. If they had played with the same amount of effort, I have no doubt they win the Bucks game at the very least. That game was lost 100% due to lack of effort on the glass and on the defensive end.
With regards to Lin, man can he be so frustrating to watch at times. He has somewhat of a tunnel vision where he keys in on the guy he wants to pass to and has no awareness of the defense lurking on the passing lanes. It's all about awareness and I hope he can mature some in this regard. Frankly, he's making the same mistakes over and over again in terms of deflected passes. His TOs could easily have been more than 3 last night as he made a couple of poor passes that his teammates bailed him out on.
It didn't just take Steve Nash and Dantoni for Nash to become Nash.
Anybody who is a Suns fan recognizes that the Suns have always surrounded Nash with ballhandling guards and forwards. The Suns have one of the best players at that in Grant Hill. Teams cannot load up on Nash because guys like Hill and Jared Dudley go into greyhound mode when openings are created.
If Nash did not have the backcourt help (his first few rocky years in Dallas), people would be complaining about his lack of.handle too.
MrScrewup: I share in your observation of Lin's apparent limits and repeated mistakes as a passer and ball handler. Lin is like a quarterback who locks in a receiver - good defenses diagnose that quickly. I also haven't liked how often he has passed to a big on a pick and roll in a crowded paint area. These are reasons I've categorized Lin as a SG/PG combo guard. I don't doubt Lin can and will improve his ball handling, but what about his passing? I'm less confident. There's a reason Lin didn't play PG at Harvard when he was by far the best guard - and player - on the Crimson. In the post-game after Rubio defended him well, Lin said something that was telling: he talked about how the Timberwolves defended the "gray areas" well in picking off his passes. That to me was Lin acknowledging he has blind spots in his (half) court vision. His passing is good enough for a NBA combo guard, but to be a high-level full-time PG? I don't know that experience can solve the passing weakness in Lin's game, or if it's innate and fixed. At this point, we can hope. It's too early in Lin's career to say he won't ever pass well enough to become a high-level full-time PG.
KHuang: True. Even during the Linsanity Knicks, not so much play-making by Lin's teammates. The Davis/Lin backcourt was attractive for possibly improving the secondary playmaking on the floor. Landry Fields was one of the few Knicks who showed ability to make secondary plays in D'Antoni's system.
Related: I'm surprised that Stoudamire and Lin have had so much trouble meshing. Stoudamire has meshed with Nash, Felton, and Davis, but not Line. Lin misses Stoudamire a lot when he's open and Stoudamire has trouble catching Lin's passes.
Their defense has definitely improved by leaps and bounds, pretty amazing to watch. As many have commented, where was this defence during the losing streak? If they can keep up this defense and up the offense, the knicks will be a strong contender. The next game won't be easy though...the pacers will want revenge on their own home turf. One advantage the Knicks have is that they have such a deep bench that if they keep switching players around, it'll confuse the opposing team a bit ie they'll have to go through more scenarios and come up with different strategies on the fly.
By the way, I loved the 3-pointer JLin took just before the 1st half ended. Am just glad all this change of coach thing hasn't affected his confidence :)
Defense won this game. If you compare the defense of Carmelo & Amare vs. Pacers and their D during the 6 game losing streak, it's like night and day. It's like they can turn it on ... if they really wanted to. Which means, Knicks could have beaten Boston, Milwaukee, maybe even the Bulls .... only if the 2 superstars want to play D and rebound. As if getting paid $100 million is not enough motivation.
LOL. Woodson back-tracking all day today.
ReplyDeleteYesterday:
Rookies, youngsters, gotta know their place. Melo and Amare are the unquestioned stars who will take the big shots.
Today:
We're all about team ball and depth. Jeremy is definitely my starting PG. And I'm fine with Jeremy taking the big shot at the end.
Yeah, that last second 3-pointer by JLin to close the half. That speaks volumes about his character. He deserves to be an NBA star, anything less would be a wasted of his skill and hard work.
DeleteBtw. Baron Davis left the game with a strained hamstring.
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteWoodson was probably told by the Knicks management to stop putting down Lin in the public. They know nothing good can come out of that for them business-wise
DeleteCommenting on... ESPN's article titled: 'Davis Out With Right Hamstring Injury' March 16, 2012 9:13 PM
Delete-----------------------
Oh Boy.... This is getting really interesting in a slimy sort of way - transpiring egos, greed, and jealousy.
Ever since Mike D was out, for 2 days Woodson has been taking a lot of thinly-veiled cheap shots and insults at Lin and Mike D; then he was told to damage control on behalf of himself and the organization with "Lin is our starting PG... blah blah", all the while fully expecting Jeremy Lin to do badly in the "conventional" system, at which point Woodson can revert back to his original plan to make Baron Davis the starter - then marginalizing Lin would be justified in the minds of the public.
But since Davis is again injured during this game - and since Lin played well (what the f !$#! surprise!) and the trade deadline has passed - Woodson may be forced to behave more neutrally (that's like kissing his axx) towards Lin, NOW THAT Woodson NEEDS Lin.
Users!.....
-- Use Lin for winning
-- Use Lin for greed (over hyping to the point of Lin's "teammates" not coming to his aid when 3 Mavericks players (ironically happens to be a white guy, a black guy, and a hispanic) ganged up on Lin in an attempt to break his neck and give him brain damage on March 6th)
-- Use Lin for scapegoating (when it was Carmelo's "my way or the highway" attitude)
-- Win a few games after the shake up (which always happens)
-- For the 2nd time scapegoat Lin... for the 2nd time, Lin is a "fluke" (I'm guessing another losing streak due to more things not going melonoma's way)
Stop using and abusing Lin!... You've got a decent PG almost for free!!!!!!.... You (Dolan) have already made a ton of $$$$$ off of him (for you, it's not about the fan - only business and greed).... You've ordered a shrimp but got a lobster instead.... Stop complaining already!
this is the most D i've seen the knicks play in a while
ReplyDeleteWell, so far Woodson has kept his promise. Great team ball on both ends.
ReplyDeleteMaybe this'll work?
DeleteLinsanity continues... :)
ReplyDeleteIt's more like Woodsanity now.
DeleteIt's clear what's going on here. Linsanity has become too big to reverse. I'm sure Woodson had in mind to slowly phase out Jeremy in favor of Baron, but this is where the top management and comes in to intervene. They knew if they killed Linsanity, the Knicks will ultimately lose money. With Baron close to his last straw in his career, his value and future potential just isn't there. Pretty simple. Tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Like Jeremy, I too have an economics degree ;)
ReplyDelete- Nemo
Hope your economic mind won't override your basketball one like the Knicks' management. Long time no see, Nemo, welcome back!
DeleteNemo - Exactly!
DeleteJeremy is so grounded; I don't know how and why he can play so well for Woodson, who have pretty much trashed Lin in the media, over-flexing his new coaching muscle, not thinking of anything else except to please Carmelo.
I know Lin is paid to play his best and he must be a professional, BUT with Woodson's garbage mouth, why "validate" the firing?
This is one of the reasons why I believe Lin will do better IF he could play with the 2nd group; that way Lin (and other good guys) will do well AND the Knicks still lose.... Now, with Davis' injury (again), it's less likely for Woodson to implement his not-so-secret desire.
There's always an initial bump with coach change (even the T Blazers won over the Bulls). I don't think the Knicks will make the playoffs, and I no longer root for them..... Regardless, Lin will do fine.
Hm. Reason 1 why Davis won't replace Lin as starter or 1st team PG: Davis's injury history.
ReplyDeleteYou're having a great game, Jeremy.
ReplyDeleteDon't tarnish it with silly TOs! They don't matter in this game, but just to silence any doubts, you gotta keep 'em low.
Channel your inner Acie Law.
Good game overall for Lin. He played some good D on Darren Collison, forcing him to take some tough shots.
ReplyDeleteNegatives: Forced a few bad passes when being harassed by the defense. Needs to stop trying to pass OVER defenders, it will get deflected away. This is the NBA, every defender can jump.
Some silly reach in fouls on post players going to the rim. If he's not going to block the shot, don't try.
"Needs to stop trying to pass OVER defenders."
DeleteI totally agree. He needs to learn the bounce pass through the legs. Or just call the timeout.
Still can't take away from a fine all-around performance tonight, though.
The key is to get a good angle on the passes. Passing over the outstretched fingertips of opponents is just plain dumb.
DeleteThe veterans would either:
A) Pump Fake a lob pass, then lean to the left or right for a bounce pass.
B) Lean into the defender and pass around him.
It takes practice, patience, and staying calm and not panicking when being doubled.
Good points. I hope they're running some special drills for him in practice because this is obviously a situation that will pop up over and over again.
DeleteSimulate a successful hard trap by "stopping the clock," putting two defenders around him, giving Jeremy the ball, and starting the clock again. Then give him three seconds to safely pass the ball out of the double-team.
Practice drills can only get you so far. It takes real game experience to understand how to beat a hard trap.
DeleteKind of like how players can shoot lights out at shootaround but miss their jumpers when the game is on the line. It will take some experience, and unfortunately some turnovers before he learns.
In the meantime, it's good that Lin doesn't need to drive to the basket every time on offense. If he can learn to use the opponent's "Fear of the drive" to create space for shots and open passing lanes. That will keep him from getting beat up going into the lane all the time.
Anybody else notice how radically different the offense looks now? I can barely remember one Pick N roll. Jeremy was a mere decoy on a ton of possessions. The ball definitely runs through Melo's hands now. Most of Jeremy's assists tonight were of the "heads-up", fast break/ cherry-picking variety. He is no longer the initiator of the offense.
ReplyDeleteAm I the only one seeing this?
Sigh
yes, but i think as long as knicks play defense this style of offense of going through melo is better for the knicks.
DeleteI agree. No need for JLin to keep driving to the basket all the time. What he has to develop is short to medium jump shot.
DeleteIt is so sad to see Jeremy has to sacrifice his own game to accomodate those so called superstars and make them play defense.
DeleteSigh...
We shouldn't be complaining.
DeleteThe Knicks beat a very strong Pacers team and Lin played very well. This could work.
Ironically, Melo and Stoudemire each scored less than Lin did.
I have my doubts about Woodson, but I'm open to his ways if he continues to start Lin and Lin plays well.
I know you love Lin and I do too but come on he played a good game just be happy. I actually want Melo and Amare to play well also. It takes the pressure off of Lin. It's good they got a win. Go Lin!
DeleteFrom the performance of the recent games plus tonight's, are the superstars still superstars now? We should all let Woodson know that we seriously challenge the "superstar" status.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteMaybe in a crazy way, what you are asking for is exactly what Woodson wants.
DeleteKeep in mind that basketball is a fluid game that requires coaches to change philosophy in the fly. A coach will do one thing and then have to scrap it entirely when the opponent responds differently.
If anybody can play well through basketball's fluidity, it's Lin who is on his "6th or 7th system" in less than 2 years!
Playing without the ball in his hands as much can help him. He doesn't need to create off the bounce as often, can catch and shoot more. He can also utilize his jab step and super-quick first step after he catches. This will probably leave him more energy for defense.
DeleteEither way he's a good ball player with great fundamentals so he'll be just fine.
Having the offense goint through Melo alone isn't a good idea either. His FG average is only around 40%.
DeleteHeard the announcer say Davis pulled a hammi...here comes that injury history of his. Hope it's not too bad. The Knicks will need him to give JLin some rest. Overall, great game from JLin and the Knicks. It's fun to watch team basketball and defense!
ReplyDeleteYeah I was thinking that was right no cue lol. He is def injury prone and that could be God's way of letting Jeremy know he is the starting pg : ) Baron played really well for the short time he played but NO ONE should be surprised that he pulled his hamstring.
DeleteCome one man, you going to say God let someone get hurt so someone else can advance. Think about it. That's not even right. lol...smh
Deletehey God works in mysterious ways lol.
DeleteLike the rest of the team, it looked like Davis gave extra effort on O and D. He played well - well enough to fuel the Davis v Lin debate.
DeleteBut in playing well, Davis pushing his legs harder than usual likely led to his pulled hamstring. End of debate: Lin's game may be more flawed and he's inexperienced, but Davis is brittle with a long injury history. Davis needs to be handled with care, which means moderating his playing pace, minutes, and role.
It looks better that the offense doesnt run through Lin's hands, takes the pressure off of him plus he can create his own shot.
ReplyDeleteBut it says a lot about Melo's selfish personality that he wouldn't play defense if the offense didn't run through him... Still hope that JLin can get away from this kind of teammate next season.
ReplyDeleteLin Played a decent game tonight but had 3 t/o in 26 minutes of play.. Those seemed like mental lapses that could had been avoided. It was an overall good game none the less. He played some good D as well. Next challenge is tomorrow. Pacer will want pay back.
ReplyDeleteYeah what is this whole new energy coming out of every knicks player? Was there a conspiracy to get Mike D'antoni fired? Carmelo has this swagger like he's won something.
ReplyDeleteWoodson flip flopping on his comment about Lin being benched to Lin is still the starting point guard is crazy!
I hope Jlin goes to the spurs or mavs next year where he can learn from very good pg veteran like parker and kidd. Although he may not get the starting job he will learn alot from those vets, because I'm sure B. Davis is not trying to teach JLin anything. Deep inside B. Davis is hating on JLin, Melo, Stoudamire are hating on Lin.
Don't you guys feel like Jlin is like Jackie Robinson of Baseball who broke the color barrier in baseball. Racism is not dead, it still lives dormant in society. Linsanity has sprouted that dormant racist thoughts and has been exposed to the public. I think as Asian Americans and Asian immigrants we need to voice our opinion about how sports analysts, media, and the NBA sometimes degrade Jlin's skills and ability. I know they are doing this just because he's Asian. They just can't accept that an Asian guy can actually be a good and potentially become a superstar basketball player.
They already hate on us Asian because they think that we're all stereo-typically smart and should leave black/white dominated sports alone.
I do appreciate that other people who are not asian can see the truth about Jlin and speak the truth about his skills. I just hate obvious racists who would say anything just to degrade Jlin's game.
I don't really see that they hate him. If you think Melo, Amare and davis hates him then what makes you think the people on other teams won't hate him too.
DeleteThe racists don't like Lin?
DeleteFine. BRING EM ON!
The worst that can happen is that Lin turns the ball over too much and guys continue to have low percentage shooting nights against him.
If Lin plays the way we know he can play, he will continue to be a valuable NBA starter for years to come. Anybody that benches Lin had better replace him with a player that Lin cannot humiliate daily in practice. The haters will come at him and Lin will SMACK THEM DOWN the way he's been punking Baron Davis in practice.
The racists fear most an Asian American champion who can kick their butts intellectually and physically. Jeremy Lin is that champion - and so can YOU be too.
I'd rather Lin get in the game and learn by playing than sit behind an established star.
DeleteBesides, Lin has been terrific as a starter. I will keep saying that Linsanity rages on until Lin is knocked out of the league.
I honestly don't get why you guys keep bringing racism into the equation. If your gonna take a knock at melo and stats opinion of Lin, at least criticise their ego. Honestly, there really is nothing you can claim that suggest both these guys are racists. In fact some of you used to say mike d was a racist for burying Lin on the bench. It's pretty obvious now mike wasn't..
DeleteI am watching the SA vs OKC now. I got over the JLin reducing his role a little bit right now.
ReplyDeleteI now think that the new offense may give JLin an excellent chance to improve his mid range game, 3 point shooting and court management. It will make him to become a more all-around player. I mean Tony Parker when he first came into the league also had to face the task of feeding the ball to Duncan in the half court when he was clearly better in the open court but he learnt and adapted, now he is great at nearly all the aspects. I remember that Parker also had tons of TOs and got benched a lot of times when he was young as well. And same for Nash when he had to feed Finley and Dirk in his Dallas days.
I hope that JLin will be learning the same way as Parker and Nash in their younger days and then eventually when he gets into a new team or the so called stars get older he will have an offense built around his talents and develop into a true superstar. Short term, it may be bad for JLin and his many fans. But long term, it will be a great scenario! But he and us as fans will need to accept and learn the short team pains!
To be honest, I feel that Tony Parker play the pick and roll and in the open court really very similar to our JLin...
Oh, this is not "bad" to us hardcore NBA fans.
DeleteWe here in jeremylin.net are veteran basketball watchers who understand that the game isn't about statistics and superstars and all that. We LOVE what Lin is doing, even when he wasn't getting much of a chance to do it.
You are correct that all good PGs go through the struggles Lin has. Lin is WAY AHEAD of any young pg except for maybe John Wall and possibly Kyrie Irving. Lin has All Star talent and will make the team at some point in his career no matter who's coaching him.
One more thing. Tony Parker wouldn't be "Tony Parker" without the great Tim Duncan setting those picks for him. Put Parker on another team and he'd look like a #29 pick and not an All Star.
You guys aren't seriously complaining about not having the offense go through Lin are you?? They just trashed another team yet again, that's twice they made two teams the Knicks bitches.. Look as long as Lin is starting and the Knicks are beating their opponents by a wide margin, I could care less if he scores less than 5 pts... This is good for Lin to be honest, it means he won't be injury prone and he'll have a long lasting career in the NBA...
ReplyDeleteAs long as THIS is what the Knicks' new look offense is, I'm all for it.
DeleteIt's just that before the game, Woodson, Amare, the entire sports media, and even Jeremy all strongly suggested they were going to play a lot more iso-ball, with the fake-superstars going one-on-one as much as possible.
But again, if this the what Woodson has in mind, then HECK YEAH, I'm all for it. This was team-ball with great defense.
as long as lin starts, get mins, and contribute, i'm all for it.
ReplyDeleteI still don't understand how anyone can idolise Carmelo Anthony. I mean it is very laugable to me that now he tries to play defense, team ball and pass unselfishly when he finally gets everything his way and his wish. It is also very funny that people dismiss Jeremy as a system player but in fact Carmelo is the one who didn't even bother to show up in games when he wasn''t the lone featured player. The more unselfishly he plays now, the more selfish of a player he shows, in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteBut with Jeremy, he now may not get the offense built around him but he will continue to work hard that is no doubt in my mind. His defense, hustle, passing ability, heart, never say die attitude and all around skills will not disappear in any games and any systems, unlike his one certain teammate!!
And I personally have not much respect for this new coach either. I mean how far you can go as a coach if you are just a "listening to stars" and "listening to management" guy. I doubt he has much respect from the players as well. In his mind, he also knows that if Carmelo could force MDA out, he could also force him out as well. Haha...
Passing along:
ReplyDeleteto vote for your favorite athletes in New York.
http://espn.go.com/newyork/bracket/mostbeloved
Semifinal is next week. Cut and paste the website and vote for JLin.
You are darn right I'm unhappy even though they won. Why am I unhappy?
ReplyDelete(1) This article pretty much sums it up: http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/20299/carmelo-anthony-joy-wrecker . Instead of this beautiful fluid offense that we saw in the 7 game win-streak, we're stuck with the stagnant ISO Melo-ball offense that we're going to see moving forward. I've been so disgusted I couldn't watch the game today, and I'm not sure I'll be able to watch the Knicks moving foward. Believe me, I want to support jlin as much as anyone, but it's just too painful right now to watch.
(2) So...now Carmelo finally decides to get motivated and play defense,rebound, and share the ball (5 assists tonight). Where was this when they were losing 6 straight games? Where was this when Jlin had an MVP play and completely shut down Brandon Jennings. How come Carmelo didn't get the defensive rebound...I watched that play 7 times straight and that was Carmelo's man and not Amare's fault at all!!! What happened to defense/rebounding in SA, Chicago, 76ers, and even the Milwaukee game? Guys on this team (Carmelo for sure..who else..I'm not sure) quit and yes I'm not happy. Check this link out for verification: http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/post/_/id/14374/amare-we-didnt-all-buy-in-so-mda-quit. Marsh-melo could have tried to fit into Dantoni's system and it might have worked, but he always wanted to be top dog and never second-fiddle.
(3) Woodson doesn't seem to bright to me though I know it's too early to tell. I base this on the fact that he's handled the media like a rookie coach would. He was trying to show support for his two biggest "stars" with his comments while completely alienating jlin. This was a big mistake and a bad political move that he had to backtrack on. I think it kind of shows his true nature though. I'm iffy on how he will treat Jlin moving forward long term. In the short-term, he''ll have to appease the fans and media by playing jlin a lot, but the minute he struggles..... I hope I'm wrong on this.
(4) I guess one thing that I am happy about is that jlin has less pressure on him which will give him some time to develop, but this system won't ever allow jlin to become a superstar. On one hand, I am satisfied even now with all of the incredible things that have happened to him and am so proud of what he's done. On the other hand, I think the potential is there for greatness, but it likely won't happen with this coach and this system. He'll be a solid role player at best. Woodson has a history with Atlanta of throwing the ball into Josh smith and Joe Johnson while alienating everyone else on the team.
(5) My prediction: Knicks will make playoffs and actually will do well for the rest of the season. They might even make it into the second round of the playoffs. They'll never be championship material with what they have currently. I think the "mailman" Carmelo Anthony who mailed in effort, defense, and rebounding to get rid of the coach and get the system he wanted in place will be the most motivated he's ever been. With the distraction of the rift in the locker room and coaching situation gone, they will play better and this will continue through the end of the season. However, at some point, the deficiencies in the system/Carmelo centric system will show up again next year unless something dramatically changes ie Camelo is traded and a new coach is hired.
Come to think in another angle, I think we dont need to worry too much about Jeremy. I think he will be decent and solid in this limited role. Actually now all the pressure is on Carmelo, if he cant produce some results, there is a bigger chance of him being booed out of the New York City, and I highly doubt that he can do anything special with his style. Jeremy will be okay. By the time Carmelo contract finishes, Jeremy is still only 26-27 years old. Although we dont want to see him waste his time in this bad organized franchise, keep in mind that he will be still be very young and very much in his prime, he then can get out of NY or NY management may have changed to be better. Steve Nash did not become MVP until being traded at 30. If Jeremy can continue to work hard, there is no doubt in my mind that he can have a similar career. Just that he may also need to take his time and wait for his chance like Nash when he was young. How ironic! Also Jeremy has a high chance of being voted in as an All Star even he is just a solid starter!
DeleteOne more think if Jeremy is as good as we think he can be he should be able to shine in any system or even he is not being featured in offense. No doubt MDA system is prefect for him but he should not do too bad in other systems as well. By the time he plays well, more recognition will come because people can no longer dismiss him as a byproduct of a certain system!
DeleteJLin is not ready right now to be a star; it's better for him to keep playing at least 20+ minutes per game in any role and keep improving. If he can show his versatility and can play in different systems, his value and chance of playing in NBA for long term will increase significantly because one thing he has that most other NBA players do not have is the same marketing power and the ability to bring in new fans to the game because of his ethnicity and his educational background, his being well-spoken and down-to-earth and the fact he wears his religion/faith on his sleeves. NBA needs JLin just as badly to expand NBA to the Asian markets, so if I were JLin, I would just focus on improving steadily and let things happen around him. The worst thing that can happen to him at this stage in his career is for any team to have to depend on him as the "star" of the team. The fact that Linsanity happened is because no friggin people expected any of this and other Knicks players rallied around him and what he stood for.
DeleteStatistically, Lin already IS a star.
DeleteEven with the bad teammates and Jordan rules and frequent TOs, Lin has managed to singlehandedly keep the Knicks alive in almost every game.
Lin is a great NBA star who'll continue to dominate for years to come, provides that injuries don't wreck his game.
still don't understand how anyone can idolise Carmelo Anthony. I mean it is very laugable to me that now he tries to play defense, team ball and pass unselfishly when he finally gets everything his way and his wish. It is also very funny that people dismiss Jeremy as a system player but in fact Carmelo is the one who didn't even bother to show up in games when he wasn''t the lone featured player. The more unselfishly he plays now, the more selfish of a player he shows, in my opinion.
ReplyDeleteBut with Jeremy, he now may not get the offense built around him but he will continue to work hard that is no doubt in my mind. His defense, hustle, passing ability, heart, never say die attitude and all around skills will not disappear in any games and any systems, unlike his one certain teammate!!
And I personally have not much respect for this new coach either. I mean how far you can go as a coach if you are just a "listening to stars" and "listening to management" guy. I doubt he has much respect from the players as well. In his mind, he also knows that if Carmelo could force MDA out, he could also force him out as well. Haha
I decided to give in and actually watch the game tonight on League pass replay. I have a few observations:
ReplyDelete(1) Did the invasion of the body snatchers happen 2 nights ago and did these invaders take over Carmelo Anthony's body and replace it with someone who plays defense, rebounds, passes, and does all the little things to win basketball games? The more likely scenario is Marshmello is highly motivated to prove the naysayers wrong. He wants to prove that Dantoni was the problem and he didn't kill linsanity (even though he did), cause the 6 game losing streak (even though he did), and that he is all about the team/winning.
(2) I only watched the first half. Marshmello took 3 awful shots, one 3 with 23 seconds left on the shot clock contested.....awful. He did have a few really nice passes since all of sudden the body snatchers have brought in a new team player.
(3) The offense with Jeremy looked much better than I thought it would. I guess that's what happens when your defense opens up easy scoring opportunities. Jeremy had a sweet pass to Carmelo off of great defense in the second quarter. Also, Carmelo wasn't the black hole he usually is which is probably key.
(4) The system is still broken because of Carmelo. His shot selection is still awful, and he will want his stats at some point. He won't deal with going 4-12 like he did tonight and losing...he' rather put up his 22 shots and "take over" once they start losing again.
(5) Woodson took out Jeremy at the 6 minute mark for Baron. I'm still guessing we're looking at average of 25 min/game for him with BD/Shump taking the rest of the minutes. They played a lot more pick and roll then I thought which is definitely a positive.
I'm perfectly fine with Lin not being the "superstar" that every single opponent has circled on their calendar and bringing their A+ game against a mediocre team. Like others said, as long as Lin is the starter, contributing, and the team is winning, then it's great. That's better than if Lin were scoring 20+ pts a night while the team is losing. This would show the league Lin's versatility, he can be the focal point of the offense, or he can be a facilitator.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you that taking that bulls-eye off of Jeremy's back is a really good thing. This will allow him to develop as I mentioned before. The point I am making is that the team **should** have gone 4-2 in that stretch during the losing streak if Carmelo hadn't mailed it in and quit. Most of the issues were not on offense..they were are all defense which as you know is all about effort.This could and should have been Jeremy AND Carmelo's team (if he tried to fit in the system), but now it's clearly Melo's team (see D wade and Lebron James). I don't think Jeremy needs to be a superstar at this point in his career (though I think his play was nearly there in the Dantoni era), but I will be really unhappy if 25 minutes per game is the norm while seeing Jeremy do all the little things to win (defense, rebounding, passing) while Carmelo gets the credit. Carmelo will be more motivated than ever so I predict they will win a lot more games, but there will be a limit to how far this team will go moving forward unless he completely changes his game.
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ReplyDeleteCarmelo Anthony is one of the most blatantly selfish players I have seen in a long time. It was more than sickening to watch his whining on not getting the ball under D’Antoni. Instead of acting like a professional and doing his best under a system that he didn’t like (that’s why he’s paid millions and millions of dollars), he sulked and slithered around like Gollum, casting aspersions and eating away at the team’s overall morale. He would rather lead a team to a sub-par performance under his quasi-leadership than allow Lin to bring a championship to long-suffering Knicks fans.
ReplyDeleteAlas, every hero story needs a villain and Anthony fits the part. His passive-aggressive sabotage of the Knicks stopped the momentum the Knicks had with Linsanity, drove coach D’Antoni away, and poisoned the locker room. What Anthony and most people do not realize (including uber-Lin fans), is that the Lin story is much bigger than they can possibly even comprehend. Lin will prevail and no matter how petty and ultimately self-destructive Anthony acts, he will not be able to change this.
It’s pathetic that the Knicks, as an organization, is so dysfunctional. What is so hard about waiting for the right players and coaches to come along? Why do the Knicks perpetually over-pay over-rated players? Over and over and over again? The Knicks won the ultimate Powerball lottery with Jeremy Lin and the organization is veering towards throwing it away rather than cashing in!
With all of the resources the Knicks have at their disposal, the Knicks should be a perennial play-off threat. I think that’s what kills Knicks fans the most; the fact that the team has so much potential but consistently squanders it away for no good reason. What the Knicks have come to symbolize is that human beings are not rational beings; rather rationalizing beings capable of rationalizing away the most idiotic, short-sighted, and stupid decisions.
Dolan is a pathetic owner incapable of managing the Knicks organization. Carmelo is no Jordan or Kobe or Lebron. He is not in basketball shape and he cannot be reasoned with, at least in his current Gollum-like incarnation. I appreciate the fact that Dolan can recognize talent, however, talent may be the most over-rated phrase when it comes determining whether or not a person will succeed. Talent coupled with a bad attitude and hubris (and let’s talk straight, Carmelo has both attributes in spades) is a recipe for disaster. Dolan can’t recognize this simple fact and needs to take responsibility for the Knicks current dysfunctional state.
Melo is not an all-around talented player who can defend in the mold of Jordan, Kobe or LeBron. You can't just shoot a lot and score 23 points per game and call yourself a great player. It's very deceiving the way media tries to convince people someone is talented. Stat has lost any explosiveness and is routinely blocked when he tries to take the ball to the basket, and he is not strong enough to go up for the shot, which in essence makes pick and rolls not very effective. As long as these two players clog up the money, Knicks will just be either no playoff or early playoff exit team. Despite this, Knicks fans want to see them play team basketball.
DeleteI see the most talent in Schumpert and Chandler actually, as well as JLin, definitely not in these so-called stars.
what are the chances lin signs with the knicks next season?
ReplyDeleteI think it is actually pretty good, especially if the formula from the last 2 games stays the same. They are playing fun team basketball. I am hearing rumors that there was an airing out among the team-mates and everyone, including Melo committed to playing unselfishly. Read it on a board somewhere but can't seem to find it again. With all the RIP talk, I always felt that Lin is already so marketable, his fans can stop wringing their hands.
DeleteActually the last two games are some kind of honeymoon period more than the norms imo. The moment the Knicks start to lose some games again, the fingerpointing and selfishness will show again. I really dont think deep down Jeremy has fun playing with such teammates. I think the most smart choice will be taking the QO for 1 year and then exploring his options the year after that. In that way he can has choice of a team that really fits him and values him. And it can also force the Knicks into making some changes to keep Jeremy happy if they want to keep him.
DeleteLet's not get too excited people, they won against a team who had a poor night, plus they won at home which has certainly boosted their game particularly during the linsanity period.
ReplyDeleteAnthony and Stat are dragging the Knicks down with their old man's game.
Stat relies on the outside shot where he prefers space or the easy basket while growling at the camera like he's just dunked on 6 people. Overhyped.
Anothony plays like a black hole, sucking the ball and offense towards him. His lack of effort on the defensive end might actually be because he no longer has the energy he once had, perhaps hiding a physical ailment. He relies completely on his offensive game to prove his worth. I never understood the hype behind this guy, Dominic Wilkins and Shawn Kemp were both flashy players but they were far more effective than Anthony. I guess growing up and learning from the most selfish player of all time, Allen Iverson, helped made him the player he is today.
It would be difficult to ship him out because this Dolan guy seems just as bad an owner as the LA Clippers guy. Lin's chance to develop further would have to be as a 6th man on the Knicks or on another team (most likely one that's a work in progress).
I'm not even a Knicks fan BTW.
I agree that Knicks will never be title contender or go deep in playoffs because these two guys are not that good. Knicks might make it to playoff because of the players in the second unit and let's face it, you don't even have to have 50% record to make it to playoff which is a joke really and designed to carry move games on TV so NBA can make more money. I rather have a smaller pool of bona-fide contenders make it to playoffs.
DeleteWoodson should realize he's got a gift handed to him by dantoni. He shouldnt mess with Linsanity. Its the year of the Dragon baby! Lin is A dragon. Its all meant to be. If anything he should bring it back with his own version of linsanity 2.0. Be the defensive man you are and make your star players own up and play D. Dragon and Defense. D&D all the time! Dont mess up a good thing Woodson. Its meant to be!
ReplyDeleteWe shouldn't forget that Coach Woodson was a first-hand witness of Linsanity, too.
ReplyDeleteBillups last year famously remarked that Anthony can do it all, when he wants to. Clearly, Anthony didn't want to do it for D'Antoni. The difference in Anthony's game since D'Antoni left, particularly his defense, is stark. Passive-aggressive Anthony didn't want to play for D'Antoni and wants to play now.
Lin's half-court defense has improved in that he's making a better effort to stick with his man and fight over screens, but Collison was still getting past him. The bigger difference in the Pacers game is Lin was able to recover because the help rotation has improved back to where it was during Linsanity. Against the Pacers, the same opposing PG drives that were going unmolested to the basket or turning into wide open assists during the losing streak were cut off.
Going from the D'Antoni system to the Woodson system is a trade-off, but not a bad trade-off for Lin.
The D'Antoni system really died when Anthony and Stoudamire returned. Anthony because he's a focal point that clashed with D'Antoni's system and Stoudamire because of his clogging the pick-and-roll space with Chandler. At the point the team on the floor no longer fit the system, the question of D'Antoni's system as the best fit for Lin became moot.
But good teams had adjusted their defense to Lin, too. Lin isn't Nash - not yet anyway. D'Antoni's system revolves around the PG. It can't be understated how heavily the system relies on the PG. D'Antoni relies on his PGs to use the full range of their skills. At the same time, however, opponents understand that if they can contain the PG, they can shut down the whole offense. D'Antoni's system encourages opposing defenses to focus on the PG. It also leaves the PG fairly naked in dealing with those defenses. The PG must have enough ball-handling skills to go where and when he wants to go, rather than where and when the defense forces him to go. The PG must be able to read, react, and counter quickly to stay ahead of the defense. In short, D'Antoni's system highlights a PG's strengths, but also exposes his weaknesses. Lin's flaws as an inexperienced PG with a combo-guard handle were exposed when good teams adjusted to him and applied a high level of pressure. Lin's ball handling skills fell short, and as early as the Timberwolves game where Rubio hounded him, the limits of his (half) court vision and passing were exposed.
Against the Pacers, Lin had the same difficulty handling the ball under pressure, with some ugly turnovers, but as we saw last night, the switch to Woodson's system eases the pressure from being a D'Antoni PG. Lin was a scoring guard before the NBA, not a point guard - the bigger adjustment for Lin has been to PG. Going to more of an off-the-ball role under Woodson is a return to Lin's game, not a departure.
I'm optimistic. Granted, it's just one game (I don't count the awful Blazers game), but it looks like Woodson's system preserves enough of Lin's strengths to allow him to be productive, while also helping to mitigate Lin's weaknesses. Lin has shown enough potential. Someday, he may be able to handle a Nash-level load of the offense as a D'Antoni PG against top defenses, but he's not there not yet. It took Steve Nash a few years to become Steve Nash, too.
Talking about fighting over screens. JLin said after the game he saw every screen coming at him because the bigs were active in calling out oncoming screens. As a result, it made easier for Jlin to go around and anticpate the screens. So what happened when D'Antoni was there? Did the bigs intentionally wanted JLin to fail or what? I'm just furious all of sudden these so called "superstars" or "egostars" are playing with a high intensity.
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DeleteAlso, as you alluded to the defensive rotations were back to the way it was during Linsanity. Furthermore, I didn't really see that much of a change. Everything seems pretty much status quo except the pick-n-roll is virtually nonexistent. Melo still out on the wings most of the time. When Jlin brings the ball up, you see Stat and Chandler post up and JLin would pass to either one of them instead of a pick-n-roll and moves from the ball to a screen to free Melo. The only difference obviously is the cranked up defensive intensity. I feel the change of intensity is just a matter of not to lose face for the "superstars." We'll see if this can last. Of course, I hope it works out because I do want the team to succeed because of Jlin.
DeleteThe key was that they didn't switch off on defense every time like they did under D'Antoni. Only bad switchups were when Anthony was defending Daren Collison and he got burned for a layup, Lin was guarding Danny Granger who was backing him down in the lane, but fortunately Lin was able to draw the offensive foul.
DeleteBut overall, the Knicks played great team defense, didn't switch, and went after loose balls.
This time Knicks had the benefit of getting some home foul calls. On the road it will be a different story, so they need to play near perfect basketball on the road.
Good post. I have to agree that it's really pretty much the same system that they ran. I didn't really see any ISO plays for Melo or Amare moreso than the previous games. The only difference is really the renewed effort on defense that Amare and Melo displayed last night. If they had played with the same amount of effort, I have no doubt they win the Bucks game at the very least. That game was lost 100% due to lack of effort on the glass and on the defensive end.
DeleteWith regards to Lin, man can he be so frustrating to watch at times. He has somewhat of a tunnel vision where he keys in on the guy he wants to pass to and has no awareness of the defense lurking on the passing lanes. It's all about awareness and I hope he can mature some in this regard. Frankly, he's making the same mistakes over and over again in terms of deflected passes. His TOs could easily have been more than 3 last night as he made a couple of poor passes that his teammates bailed him out on.
It didn't just take Steve Nash and Dantoni for Nash to become Nash.
DeleteAnybody who is a Suns fan recognizes that the Suns have always surrounded Nash with ballhandling guards and forwards. The Suns have one of the best players at that in Grant Hill. Teams cannot load up on Nash because guys like Hill and Jared Dudley go into greyhound mode when openings are created.
If Nash did not have the backcourt help (his first few rocky years in Dallas), people would be complaining about his lack of.handle too.
MrScrewup: I share in your observation of Lin's apparent limits and repeated mistakes as a passer and ball handler. Lin is like a quarterback who locks in a receiver - good defenses diagnose that quickly. I also haven't liked how often he has passed to a big on a pick and roll in a crowded paint area. These are reasons I've categorized Lin as a SG/PG combo guard. I don't doubt Lin can and will improve his ball handling, but what about his passing? I'm less confident. There's a reason Lin didn't play PG at Harvard when he was by far the best guard - and player - on the Crimson. In the post-game after Rubio defended him well, Lin said something that was telling: he talked about how the Timberwolves defended the "gray areas" well in picking off his passes. That to me was Lin acknowledging he has blind spots in his (half) court vision. His passing is good enough for a NBA combo guard, but to be a high-level full-time PG? I don't know that experience can solve the passing weakness in Lin's game, or if it's innate and fixed. At this point, we can hope. It's too early in Lin's career to say he won't ever pass well enough to become a high-level full-time PG.
DeleteKHuang: True. Even during the Linsanity Knicks, not so much play-making by Lin's teammates. The Davis/Lin backcourt was attractive for possibly improving the secondary playmaking on the floor. Landry Fields was one of the few Knicks who showed ability to make secondary plays in D'Antoni's system.
Related: I'm surprised that Stoudamire and Lin have had so much trouble meshing. Stoudamire has meshed with Nash, Felton, and Davis, but not Line. Lin misses Stoudamire a lot when he's open and Stoudamire has trouble catching Lin's passes.
Their defense has definitely improved by leaps and bounds, pretty amazing to watch. As many have commented, where was this defence during the losing streak? If they can keep up this defense and up the offense, the knicks will be a strong contender. The next game won't be easy though...the pacers will want revenge on their own home turf. One advantage the Knicks have is that they have such a deep bench that if they keep switching players around, it'll confuse the opposing team a bit ie they'll have to go through more scenarios and come up with different strategies on the fly.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, I loved the 3-pointer JLin took just before the 1st half ended. Am just glad all this change of coach thing hasn't affected his confidence :)
DeleteDefense won this game. If you compare the defense of Carmelo & Amare vs. Pacers and their D during the 6 game losing streak, it's like night and day. It's like they can turn it on ... if they really wanted to.
ReplyDeleteWhich means, Knicks could have beaten Boston, Milwaukee, maybe even the Bulls .... only if the 2 superstars want to play D and rebound. As if getting paid $100 million is not enough motivation.
Agreed. And how long will it be before they start falling back on bad habits? Tick, tick, tick...
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